The two types of cables are distinctly different in their construction. I am familliar with the variations in color due to degree of oxidation, but this is a structural difference that I recall first noticing years ago and have seen many times since. While I sometimes think that I am able to hallucinate tiny differences between parts, this one is real. I have bugged Mike at Bicycle Classics while looking for the finer cables, and he was aware of the distinction.
As for the Syncro stuff... sorry for second guessing you on the Syncro 1 cable thing. I never really saw many of those since they didn't work for most people. I went back and looked at my old Winning magazines to nail down the dates on which Campy first advertised certain items. This is not definative, but I think its as good as any other means for determining that first appearance of a Campy product in the 1980's. I'll post a brief list of my findings and ask for comments (later). One thing I did notice is that there was plenty of advertizing for the Syncro 1, but the Syncro 2 just kind of appeared. The question I have is this: Did the first Syncro 2 lever come out in two versions (large wrap for the 1990 Record double pivot der. and regular wrap for Athena, through Croce), or did the regular wrap model come out first? I guess the regular wrap model was interchangeable with the Syncro 1 because it had the same cable movement for a given amount of lever rotation. It seems to me that this is the only way the inserts would be the same.
> Yes Tom, I have NOS sets with the thinner stainless
> cable........for the
> second time :-) My literature says that the inserts
> are interchangeable
> for both Syncro & Syncro II.
>
> I am not sure about there being a difference in the
> fat cables. I
> understand your description, but I can't find any
> difference between the
> larger diameter gear cables. I've got hundreds of
> examples from the
> early years and the very last years. Here's an
> observation though:
> Gear cables prior to the mid '80s vary wildly in
> their coloring. It
> seems some of the strands tended to oxidize much
> faster than other
> strands within the same cable. Sometimes NOS cables
> can be nice and
> silver, consistently dull grey silver, darker grey,
> silver w/dark grey
> stripes............you get the picture. But on the
> mid '80s cables,
> they seem not to oxidize, so the color is brighter
> and consistent.
> Could it be that the older cables look to be
> coarser, because of the
> oxidized strands? But then that would not account
> for your observation
> of wind angle. Sorry, I don't have an answer.
>
> Marc Boral
>
> Tom Dalton wrote:
>
> > Marc:
> >
> > Do you have Syncro I's that were packed with the
> > skinny cables? I had the impression that the
> early
> > ones were packed with wound stainless housing and
> fat
> > cables. Maybe that's why they never worked for
> me, I
> > was using the wrong cables... oh never mind, they
> > never worked for anyone!
> >
> > Did the Syncro I's use the same inserts as the
> II's? I
> > recall the Chorus having it's own suite of inserts
> for
> > 6 and 7 speeds in both A and B positions and I
> never
> > thought of those as Syncro I fare. Thus I assumed
> > that the II came out in support of the Chorus.
> But we
> > all know what happens when we assume...
> >
> > In any event, do you know the answer to the more
> > pressing question (from my perspective) of when
> the
> > fat cables went from the coarse to the fine
> windings?
> >
> > Tom Dalton
> >
> > --- Marc Boral <mbikealive@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > > I respectfully disagree. All the NOS sets of
> Syncro
> > > (debut in '87) I
> > > have, come with the thinner stainless cables.
> > > Syncro II debuted in '88,
> > > a year after Chorus.
> > >
> > > Marc Boral
> > >
> > >
> > > Tom Dalton wrote:
> > >
> > > > As I recall, the first generation Syncro
> levers
> > > used
> > > > the heavy cables and the Snycro II's used the
> > > skinny
> > > > cables. Because the switch to an
> > > index-appropriate
> > > > cable on the Syncro II was the driving force
> > > behind
> > > > the change, it is the first appearence of
> those
> > > > shifters that you need to date. I realize
> that I
> > > am
> > > > answering your question with another question,
> but
> > > it
> > > > should be much easier to determine when Campy
> > > > introduced a new indexing system than a new
> type
> > > of
> > > > cable.
> > > >
> > > > My best guess on the intro of the Syncro II
> would
> > > be
> > > > that it coincided with the intro of Chorus. I
> > > think I
> > > > remember first seeing ad for Chorus in the
> fall of
> > > > 1987.
> > > >
> > > > As a point of general info to all list
> subscribers
> > > I
> > > > offer the following, and request correction if
> I
> > > am in
> > > > error:
> > > >
> > > > The oldest Campy cables in my stash are made
> up of
> > > > heavy strands wound at a shollow angle
> relative to
> > > the
> > > > length of the wire. The surface of the cable
> is
> > > > somewhat rough. The head is stamped with a
> > > > C-in-diamond logo on top.
> > > >
> > > > The next newer cables are have the same
> marking
> > > and
> > > > are the same thickness, but the starnds are
> finer
> > > and
> > > > are wound at a steeper angle (they wind around
> > > more
> > > > times). The suface is smoother. I think
> these
> > > came
> > > > around in the early 80's, but I have no real
> basis
> > > for
> > > > that assertion.
> > > >
> > > > The next cables are identical to those above,
> but
> > > the
> > > > logo is on the side of the head and is just a
> > > plain C.
> > > > I think of these as early C-record cables,
> > > because
> > > > they are what came with the retrofrictions.
> That
> > > puts
> > > > them at 1985/86 to 1989 or so.
> > > >
> > > > As I mentioned above, I think the first thin
> > > cables
> > > > came with the first Syncro II's at the time of
> the
> > > > Chorus intro. If I'm wrong here it is likely
> that
> > > > they came out later when the large-wrap
> Syncro's
> > > came
> > > > out to operate double pivot (Campag-nono?)
> rear
> > > ders
> > > > in 1990.
> > > >
> > > > The only subsequent change that I have noticed
> is
> > > the
> > > > revision of the C logo on the side of the
> cable
> > > end to
> > > > a "C-in-circle" logo. This is an Ergopower
> (CTI?)
> > > > change that took place around 1994 (best
> quess).
> > > >
> > > > Any better info on my dates?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > Tom Dalton
> > > >
> > > > P.S. sorry for straying into the 1990's but I
> was
> > > > hoping to provide an overview of my
> observations.
> > > The
> > > > most relevant question to this group might be
> when
> > > the
> > > > change from the first to the second of the
> > > > above-referenced designs took place.
> > > >
> > > > Reid <bob.reid1@virgin.net> wrote:
> > > > > I'm sure there is an instant answer to this
> one
>
=== message truncated ===
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