I'm definately not an expert or bearings but I have had to spec out replacements on a few occasions and have been made dizzy at the variety of items that are out there. So, yes, I am aware that some cartridge bearings are thrust bearings.
As for Phil's hubs, I tried to be careful not to slight what is clearly a sound product with an excellent reputation (cult following?). My point was simply that they are supposed to have play when correctly set up, which I find annoying. It's really just a personal issue. A properly adjusted conventional hub should have no play once it's clamped in the frame, so I feel that all hubs should be held to this standard. But if you can't feel it while riding, and the hub holds up, who cares?
Apologies for indicating that MAVICS can't be adjusted to have no play. I recall the proceedure in the manual, adjusting the hub in the frame, etc., but I thought the end result had play.
Phil Wood hubs are clearly much nicer than some of the alternatives. Cheap cartridge hubs are often set up on conventional axles which offers no support to the back side of the inner race. This includes some 'nice' hubs like the Superbe Pro's (Sanshins) that I own. With this set up, it becomes very easy to excessively preload the bearing.
> I just thought I would mention that not all sealed,
> cartridge type
> bearings are designed for axial loads. They come in
> all sorts of
> configurations, including thrust-bearings. Check
> out a catalog or web
> site from a company that manufactures them, and you
> will be surprised in
> the numerous different designs. Many of these
> companies will even make
> bearings that are specifically designed for an
> application, if you have
> the bucks to order large quantities. I have met,
> and visited with Phil
> Wood (the man) back in the late 70's, and my
> impression is that he is
> intelligent enough to choose the correct bearings
> for the job.
>
> On Thu, 11 Jan 2001 12:50:16 -0700 Bicycle Classics
> inc
> <bikevint@tiac.net> writes:
> > The comments regarding Phil hub bearing usage vs
> loose ball designs
> > is
> > interesting. Does anyone know what quirk of design
> enables old
> > Maxicar hubs
> > to behave so well? Their 1948 design seems to be
> nearly identical in
> > concept to the current phil design, yet they
> generally do not
> > display play
> > at the rim. At the same time, their longevity is
> astonishing - the
> > one off
> > my 1952 Herse runs like a champ - super smooth
> and no play that I
> > noticed.
> >
> > It is possible that these are simply being run too
> tight, but based
> > on
> > observed longevity this doesn't seem to be the
> case. Is it perhaps
> > a
> > slightly different bearing specification or
> locking arangement
> > against the
> > bearing shoulders causes this?
> >
> > In any event, it is remarkable that it took Phil
> Wood decades to get
> > to
> > where Maxicar was in the 1940's. One reason that
> Maxicar is so rare
> > in
> > this country is perhaps related to Spence Wolfs
> relationship to Phil
> > Wood.
> > Spence Wolf was perhaps the most visible importer
> of top tier french
> > goodies (i.e Alex Singer bikes) yet he had strong
> ties to Phil Wood.
> > Had
> > Wolf actively imported Maxicar products and not
> encouraged Phil
> > Wood,
> > perhaps Maxicar would have become much more
> popular.
> >
> > Any thoughts from folks who know more about this
> than myself?
> > Thanks, Mike Kone
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
>
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>
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