Re: [CR]Bates Bat.......

Example: Framebuilders:Dario Pegoretti

Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2002 10:46:30 +0000
Subject: Re: [CR]Bates Bat.......
From: Hilary Stone <>
To: Bob Reid <>, <>
In-Reply-To: <>

This is about 1937/8 - I used to have a Bates with a slightly higher frame number that was positively dated as 1938. And the earliest Cantiflex tubed Bates started at about 5500 I think in late 35/early 36.

Incidentally the '8' in the number has nothing to do with it being 1938 - Bates simply used a sequential numbering system. It sounds really quite similar to a Bates I now have which also has conventional forks.

It sounds like the fork blades are Accles and Pollocks Rapid Taper. A&P Rapid Taper fork blades came out around 1933 and were popular on sporting Sunbeams in the 30s and Les Cassell had a particular soft spot for them at Thanets.

In the early days of Cantiflex tubing and Diadrant forks Bates offered models with Cantiflex tubing and conventional forks as well as with Diadrant forks and also standard frame tubing with Diadrant forks. By late 1938 these models were dropped and you simply got Cantiflex tubing and Diadrant forks.

The repro catalogue Chuck offers illustrates the block lettering Bates used pre-war. Ray Etherton used to have reprints of this catalogue too. I don't think this style of transfer is currently offered by Nick Tithecott.

Hilary Stone in wet but warm Bristol, England

Bob Reid wrote:
> I've acquired a Bates that I'd appreciate some help identifying ;
> Frame No. is 8049 (on the bracket shell). size = 19.1/2" ST, 23" TT. Lugs
> are quite plain with only light semi circular cut's to the sides. The seat
> stay's finish on plugs attached to the seat tube lug sides, however more
> interesting is the use of Cantiflex tubing. The head tube lugs (headclip
> type) are joined in the middle by a small bar that runs across the front of
> the headtube, splitting it in two. Within the top half is an alloy badge
> with an image of a red bat and the words Bates.....Plaistow underneath. The
> forks however are not Diadrant but are extremely waisted where they change
> section from 'D' to round, about three inches below the crown.
> Although lacking any transfers or any other details I'd appreciate any help
> dating this frame and any clues as to it's original finish / transfers etc.