Re: Re: [CR]CR list time-period limits

(Example: Framebuilders:Alberto Masi)

From: "Stephen Barner" <steve@sburl.com>
To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
References: <CATFOODd22hySeBrbR800002257@catfood.nt.phred.org>
Subject: Re: Re: [CR]CR list time-period limits
Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 14:07:19 -0500


As long as we're being subjective here, I have to disagree with the Monkeyman about quality differences before and after the bike boom started.
>From the components I have seen, machining quality steadily improved during the bike boom, at least on upper end components. The boom also brought in innovative components from Japan and later the US that improved the quality of almost all bikes. As a rider who became interested in road biking in the late 60's, while it was still considered a really weird thing to do, I found the bike boom an exciting time of bicycle evolution, of which I am proud to have played a small part. I still think that the Campagnolo Record series of the 60's through early 80's is the most elegant component group every made for the bicycle, and it received steady improvement through its lifespan. While those lever changers that Campagnolo made in the 40's were mechanical marvels, I think they were design disasters. Certainly, there was a lot of rushed and shoddy production during the boom, but this was also the time of significant labor unrest and strikes in the industry, and I think this had a lot to do with the lapses in quality. I haven't seen very many pre-1970 frames that demonstrated the workmanship of the custom and high quality production frames that started appearing in the early 70's. I remember going to the New York and Las Vegas bike shows in the late 70's and early 80's and getting positively bored with all the absolutely perfect frames on display--there were just too many of them! Since these are now quality bikes of styles that are no longer made, or even recognized by many riders and bikeshop people today, I think they have earned their place in the classic category.

Steve Barner, Bolton, Vermont


----- Original Message -----
From: Brandon Ives
To: chasds@mindspring.com
Cc: oroboyz@aol.com
Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 8:55 PM
Subject: Re: [CR]CR list time-period limits



> On Monday, February 10, 2003, at 09:36 PM, chasds@mindspring.com wrote:
> > There were many fine classic bikes, by any standard, made between
> > 1980 and 1984...
>
> I think it might have more to do with the explosion of mountain bikes
> and the decline of the lightweight and not really the death of friction
> shifting of non-aero cable routing. Also you've got to remember index
> shifting actually came before friction shifting. Personally I think
> the list should stop at about 1970 and the US bicycle boom. I think
> bike quality plummeted to bring the numbers of bikes up to fill sales.
> Beyond that anything in the 70s or after is really contemporary not
> really "classic." A majority of the list talks about bikes of the 70s
> and 80s because that's when most of the list became associated with
> cycling. It's a nostalgia thing not a quality thing. Of course this
> is coming from someone who started cycling in the bike boom but wasn't
> a teenager until 1982. So what do I know, except that dale is right
> when he say's everybody has different ideas about the "cut-off date."
> ciao,
> Brandon"monkeyman"Ives
> SB, CA
>
> _______________________________________________


>


----- Original Message -----
From: classicrendezvous-request@bikelist.org
To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2003 12:18 PM
Subject: Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 2, Issue 64



> Send Classicrendezvous mailing list submissions to
> classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> classicrendezvous-request@bikelist.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> classicrendezvous-owner@bikelist.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Classicrendezvous digest..."
>
>
> CR
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: eBay mondia: Here it is, no it isn't
> 2. Re: Exceltoo hub? French? Quality? (bikenut)
> 3. Akront Rims. (dave martinez)
> 4. Re: Bikes to Bring to the Cirque (Mark Poore)
> 5. identifying old LOOK pedals (ADP)
> 6. Re: identifying old LOOK pedals (swampmtn)
> 7. Re: Peugeot Identification (Jerry & Liz Moos)
> 8. Re: Tour de France 1932, surviving rider (Jerry & Liz Moos)
> 9. Re: LOOK pedals
> 10. Pedal History, Was: identifying old LOOK pedals (David Bilenkey)
> 11. Akront Rims
> 12. Bob Jackson's legs (uh, lugs) - new pics (Paul Williams)
> 13. Re: Bianchi ID (Jerry & Liz Moos)
> 14. Re: Peugeot Jerseys back at Vintage Velos (Jerry & Liz Moos)
> 15. Re: LOOK pedals to market? (Jon M. Schaer)
> 16. Re: CR list time-period limits (Jerry & Liz Moos)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 21:15:44 EST
> From: GPVB1@cs.com
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: Re: [CR]eBay mondia: Here it is, no it isn't
> Message-ID: <63.186747e7.2b7efcd0@cs.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 1
>
> Tom, as far as I know, currently an eBay seller can cancel any auction at any
> time, for virtually any (or even no particular) reason. Doesn't matter if
> there are bids or not.
>
> This is different than the policy was a year or two ago - eBay probably
> figured it was too much of a hasssle to try and police. They just want money
> - lots of it preferably! They still get the listing fee if an auction is
> cancelled. They now get almost ten percent of every transaction (if it goes
> to completion and PayPal is used for payment...).
>
> Anyone know differently?
>
> Regards,
>
> Greg "caveat emptor" Parker
> Ann Arbor, MI USA
>
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 00:12:08 +0000
> > From: "Thomas R. Adams, Jr." <kctommy@msn.com>
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: [CR]eBay mondia: Here it is, no it isn't
> >
> > This one ended before I could decide to bid or not.
> >
> >
> >
> > http://ebay.com/<blah>
> > &rd=1
> >
> >
> >
> > No bids, so I believe no restrictions on the seller pulling the auction.
> > But that also means no reasons given on why the auction ended. I presume
> > the seller either decided to keep it himself or cut a private deal off eBay.
> >
> >
> >
> > The bike was a big frame, and looked to be in excellent shape. Very pretty
> > example of the early wild Mondia paint styles. Dale might want to grab a
> > copy of these pics for the Swiss pages. I thought the price was a tad
> > high, but apparently someone disagreed with me.
> >
> >
> >
> > Tom Adams, Shrewsbury NJ
> >
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 20:54:41 -0800
> From: "bikenut" <bikenut@gte.net>
> To: "Classic Rendevous" <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Exceltoo hub? French? Quality?
> Message-ID: <00b101c2d4ae$5ab981a0$4d183c04@dslverizon.net>
> References: <a05200f01ba7339a6fd85@[216.144.8.185]>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 2
>
> Exceltoo is French and on the higher end of things....
>
> I have seen the early steel hubs with the script and early
> Simplex skewers as well as later traditional high flange
> models similar to Maillards but with knurled/raised ridges
> and the 'Exceltoo Competition' engraving. These are very
> nice hubs for the day. I 'think' they were absorbed by
> Maillard at some point in the 60's.
>
> My 2 francs .... um euros.
>
> Matt Gorski
> Belmont Shore, CA
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Tom Hayes <hayesbikes@nls.net>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 4:40 PM
> Subject: [CR]Exceltoo hub? French? Quality?
>
>
> > I have a set of wheels, the front an old Campagnolo (I don't know how
> > old, 1950's is my guess) and the rear has an Exceltoo (written in a
> > cool script with a swirl at the end of the last "o") hub. I checked
> > the CR site under French and found Excel (I assume it's the same as
> > this) but there was no link beyond the listing of Excel (not
> > complaining, please note, only explaining).
> >
> > My question is whether this hub is French, whether it's quality or
> > not (right now it's covered with grime and grease from about thirty
> > years of sitting around). The skewer was Campagnolo and I wonder if
> > there were Excel (too?) skewers, and if there were, what's the
> > likelihood of finding one?
> >
> > I used to ask Scott Davis all my French questions and not bother the
> > list with them, but I have had a series of computer crashes (am I
> > explaining too much: he protests too much as Hamlet says) wiping out
> > all addresses and am only slowly rebuilding the address book.
> >
> > Thank you very much.
> >
> > Cheers.
> >
> > tom
> > --
> > Tom Hayes
> > 18585 Munn Road
> > Chagrin Falls, Ohio 44023
> > hayesbikes@nls.net
> > hayes@jcu.edu
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 22:50:59 -0800 (PST)
> From: dave martinez <dmart84815@yahoo.com>
> To: CR List <ClassicRendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Akront Rims.
> Message-ID: <20030215065059.46813.qmail@web41203.mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Precedence: list
> Message: 3
>
> Hello All, Akront made super strong and beautiful and highly polished aluminum rims for the Spainsh motorcycle industry. Most Spainsh Mcs. had these rims including the Bultacos and OSSA we had back in the early 70s. I heard however that the Akront rims used by Zeus were soft. Dave ( I miss the smell of Blendzall in the morning ) Martinez Fremont Ca.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 04:20:00 -0800 (PST)
> From: Mark Poore <rauler83@yahoo.com>
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: Re: [CR]Bikes to Bring to the Cirque
> Message-ID: <20030215122000.25041.qmail@web13007.mail.yahoo.com>
> In-Reply-To: <73DBB15B.0D8DAFA9.00211578@netscape.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Precedence: list
> Message: 4
>
>
> After much thought, that didn't take too long; I will be bringing my 1983 #23 Rauler, could also squeeze the Olmo, Tommaso, Tommasini and/or Colnago in as well. Looking at my collection it is impossible to find a bike in which the man behind the curtain wasn't fueled by pasta and red wine.
>
>
>
> Mark, pass the pasta please, Poore
>
>
>
> In a very snowy Slatyfork, WV
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 08:11:24 -0500
> From: ADP <aphillips9@mindspring.com>
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: [CR]identifying old LOOK pedals
> Message-ID: <5.1.1.6.2.20030215080611.03b0b008@pop3.norton.antivirus>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Precedence: list
> Message: 5
>
> Hi...
>
> I have some just-about-list-era LOOK pedals that came on my brave,
> selfless, "Campagnolo Donor Bicycle."
>
> I'd like to know what they are and if cleats are still available.
>
> Please email me and I'll send you a pic. Also, if there are any particular
> poses that would assist in identification, let me know...
>
>
>
> Ann Phillips - Atlanta GA
> home of unsuspecting Campagnolo Donor Bicycles
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 08:42:55 -0500
> From: "swampmtn" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> To: "ADP" <aphillips9@mindspring.com>,
> <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]identifying old LOOK pedals
> Message-ID: <000401c2d4f8$3b6be5a0$d734fea9@mokry>
> References: <5.1.1.6.2.20030215080611.03b0b008@pop3.norton.antivirus>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 6
>
> I'd like to look at your Looks to see if they look like the Looks I liked so
> much when the Look look still looked new.
>
> Thanks for looking,
>
> Aldo Ross
> Middlewrerwe, Ohio
>
> P.S. send pic and I'll see if I can help ID them.
> AR
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: ADP <aphillips9@mindspring.com>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2003 8:11 AM
> Subject: [CR]identifying old LOOK pedals
>
>
> > Hi...
> >
> > I have some just-about-list-era LOOK pedals that came on my brave,
> > selfless, "Campagnolo Donor Bicycle."
> >
> > I'd like to know what they are and if cleats are still available.
> >
> > Please email me and I'll send you a pic. Also, if there are any
> particular
> > poses that would assist in identification, let me know...
> >
> >
> >
> > Ann Phillips - Atlanta GA
> > home of unsuspecting Campagnolo Donor Bicycles
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 08:56:01 -0600
> From: "Jerry & Liz Moos" <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> To: "Daniel Swords" <danielswords@yahoo.com>,
> <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Peugeot Identification
> Message-ID: <080d01c2d502$5bd51fa0$efddfea9@mooshome>
> References: <20030203184052.98368.qmail@web14802.mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 7
>
> Carbolite was gaspipe used on low end Peugeots. The bike is probably not
> worth more than $95, perhaps less, unless it has some interesting parts you
> can use elsewhere.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jerry Moos
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Daniel Swords" <danielswords@yahoo.com>
> To: <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 12:40 PM
> Subject: [CR]Peugeot Identification
>
>
> > There is a Peugeot for sale in my area for $95.00.
> > The only info available is that it is a "mid-80's" 12
> > speed with SX-610 on the Simplex der. and
> > Carbolite-103 decal on the seat tube. ANy ideas on
> > the model or value of this bike (I have three PX-10s
> > so if this is a lower quality model I am not going to
> > investigate further).
> >
> > Daniel S. Swords
> > New Orleans, LA
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 09:01:46 -0600
> From: "Jerry & Liz Moos" <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> To: "Aldo Ross" <swampmtn@siscom.net>,
> <520061944949-0001@T-Online.de>, <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Tour de France 1932, surviving rider
> Message-ID: <084801c2d503$28e68790$efddfea9@mooshome>
> References: <18flB2-1Gn3q5C@fwd10.sul.t-online.com>
> <003101c2cbbe$6df39560$6cf9fea9@j4g1x1>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 8
>
> Perhaps the gentleman was referring to the 16th place finish of his teammate
> Stoepel in 1931. You said he is easily confused, so he could easily been
> off by one year.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jerry Moos
> Houston,TX
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Aldo Ross" <swampmtn@siscom.net>
> To: <520061944949-0001@T-Online.de>; <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 1:57 PM
> Subject: Re: [CR]Tour de France 1932, surviving rider
>
>
> > 16th place in the 1932 TdF??? Maurice Archambaud of France.
> >
> > But here are the German finishers from 1931-1933:
> >
> > 1931
> > 8. Erich Metze
> > 11. Oskar Thierbach
> > 16. Kurt Stoepel
> > 19. Ludwig Geyer
> > 20. Herbert Sieronski
> > 22. Hermann Buse (All)
> > 23. Alfred Siegel (All)
> >
> > 1932
> > 2. Kurt Stoepel
> > 7. Oskar Thierbach
> > 22. Ludwig Geyer
> > 39. Herbert Sieronski
> > 48. Karl Altenburger
> > 56. Georg Umbenhauer
> > 57. Rudolf Risch
> >
> > 1933
> > 10. Kurt Stoepel
> > 12. Ludwig Geyer
> > 23. Oskar Thierbach
> >
> > Hope this helps.
> >
> > Aldo Ross
> > Middletown, Ohio
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: toni theilmeier <Toni.Theilmeier@t-online.de>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 1:25 PM
> > Subject: [CR]Tour de France 1932, surviving rider
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> > I am not into statistics, but there must surely be someone among the CR
> > crowd who knows who came 16th in the 1932 TdF.
> >
> > I have by pure coincidence met an elderly gentleman (whose wife does not
> > want him to be contacted because he is getting easily confused) in a place
> > near to where I work who states vehemently that he was this 16th, and that
> > he was in one team with Kurt Stoepel, the first German to do well in the
> > Tour.
> >
> > First of course I would very much like to know whether I really shook the
> > hand of a thirties TdF rider, and secondly he lost all his mementoes about
> > his racing carreer in the war, their flat was bombed. So if anyone who has
> > any pictures, newspaper cuttings or so about him would be so kind as to
> help
> > me, and consequentially the elderly gentleman, out with photocopies /
> > Xeroxes or jpegs, I would be most grateful. Please do not wait too long,
> he
> > has less and less clear moments.
> >
> > Thank you very much,
> >
> > Toni Theilmeier, Osnabrueck, Germany.
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:02:48 EST
> From: OROBOYZ@aol.com
> To: aphillips9@mindspring.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: Re: [CR] LOOK pedals
> Message-ID: <fb.38165bc6.2b7fb098@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 9
>
> In a message dated 2/15/2003 8:12:13 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> aphillips9@mindspring.com writes:
>
> << I have some just-about-list-era LOOK pedals that came on my brave,
> selfless, "Campagnolo Donor Bicycle."
>
> I'd like to know what they are and if cleats are still available.
>
> Please email me and I'll send you a pic. Also, if there are any particular
> poses that would assist in identification, let me know...
> >>
> I am fairly certain that Look and all clipless pedals are literally and
> philosophically out of the CR time frame.. Can anyone correct my distinct
> impression that clipless were introduced after 1983?
>
>
> Dale Brown
> Greensboro, North Carolina
> <A HREF="http://www.classicrendezvous.com/main.htm">Classic Rendezvous</A>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:03:28 -0500
> From: "David Bilenkey" <dbilenkey@sympatico.ca>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Pedal History, Was: identifying old LOOK pedals
> Message-ID: <HBECIOPCNPKEJLCJBKNKAECNFGAA.dbilenkey@sympatico.ca>
> In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030215080611.03b0b008@pop3.norton.antivirus>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 10
>
> I thought these links (particularly the second) might interest the group:
>
> This is the first look pedal (down at the bottom):
>
> http://www.lookcyclesusa.com/pedals.htm
>
> I have a number of the second gen ones (the black ones that came out in
> '86?) Current cleats still work on them.
>
> And here's some interesting dates:
>
> http://www.speedplay.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=home.history
>
> >From the above link; "1947 Self-clinching, quick-release toe strap is
> invented (Binda-type)." So what did the racers use before 1947?
>
> Also it looks like Keywin pedals would actually be within CR timeline
> limits.
>
> David Bilenkey
> Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
>
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org
> > [mailto:classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org]On Behalf Of ADP
> > Sent: February 15, 2003 8:11 AM
> > To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: [CR]identifying old LOOK pedals
> >
> >
> > Hi...
> >
> > I have some just-about-list-era LOOK pedals that came on my brave,
> > selfless, "Campagnolo Donor Bicycle."
> >
> > I'd like to know what they are and if cleats are still available.
> >
> > Please email me and I'll send you a pic. Also, if there are any
> > particular
> > poses that would assist in identification, let me know...
> >
> >
> >
> > Ann Phillips - Atlanta GA
> > home of unsuspecting Campagnolo Donor Bicycles
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:13:27 EST
> From: Dckretzer@aol.com
> To: "Classic Rendezvous" <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Akront Rims
> Message-ID: <12e.2315519b.2b7fb317@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 11
>
>
> <Who can tell me a little about Akront rims? I have a pair of Akront tubular
> rims laced to Zeus hubs but I've never seen any Akronts before.
>
> Any info appreciated.>
> As Jamie and Otis already pointed out, Akronts were just the thing to upgrade
> a Bonneville, Commando or Lightning. Today, they are still being used on some
> BMW motorcycles, particularly the GS models where a lightweight and strong
> laced rim is required. I'm not familiar with their bicycle rims.
> Dan Kretzer
> Centerport, NY
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:36:16 -0500
> From: "Paul Williams" <castell5@sympatico.ca>
> To: "Classic Rendezvous" <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Cc: OROBOYZ@aol.com
> Subject: [CR]Bob Jackson's legs (uh, lugs) - new pics
> Message-ID: <01c201c2d510$5cd8cba0$4df1fea9@queensu.ca>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> Precedence: list
> Message: 12
>
> After some advice from David Bilenkey and a request from Dale for some =
> pictures of the lugwork on the Jackson, I have updated the album I =
> posted yesterday:
>
> http://www.imagestation.com/album/review.html?id=3D4290670675
>
> I am also going to be sending some of these pics for Dale to add to the =
> CR Bob Jackson page.
>
> Paul Williams,
> Ottawa "where it is even colder today", ON, Canada
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:44:05 -0600
> From: "Jerry & Liz Moos" <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <BECaldwell@aol.com>, <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>,
> <robertson_mark@hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Bianchi ID
> Message-ID: <10a801c2d511$746e2110$efddfea9@mooshome>
> References: <110.1fd2de03.2b79038d@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 13
>
> Brian, sounds like the Bianchi "TSX/UL", the model being named after the
> tubing it used. This was one of the two top steel models made up until
> about 1999 or 2000, when Bianchi stopped making lugged steel road frames.
> This frame was made for a long time, at least back into the mid-80's. The
> model name and tubing may have been different on earlier examples, but the
> design and construction was essentially the same. One list member has one
> in Legnano colors, probably from the mid-80's, by which time Bianchi had
> absorbed Legnano. I bought two of these frames near the end of the model's
> production life, one in the classic celeste for myself and one like yours in
> "midnight blue" with celeste lettering. The blue one is for my wife who,
> (dare I say it?) dislikes celeste. The celeste lettering is about as much
> as her sense of color can tolerate.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jerry Moos
> Houston, TX
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <BECaldwell@aol.com>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>; <robertson_mark@hotmail.com>
> Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 7:30 AM
> Subject: [CR]Bianchi ID
>
>
> > Guys:
> > A friend has acquired a lugged steel Bianchi frame. Being
> Bianchi-challenged,
> > I offered to put it to the experts for an ID on the likely age of it...I
> > think it is a newer frame, and the photos he sent me show it to be very
> > attractive. Heres what I can tell you:
> >
> > -Dark blue, with celeste green lettering;
> > -chromed fork blades and stays (looks like a unicrown fork?)
> > -straightforward lugs, with a "B" (painted celeste of course) engraved on
> the
> > tangs of the top tube lugs
> > - Tubing decal reads Columbus Bianchi, Cromor Cyclex, TSX Ultralight
> >
> > Thanks for any feedback on age...I do have photos, email me offline if
> > interested.
> >
> > Brian Caldwell
> > Snow, again and again and again
> > Knoxville TN
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:04:23 -0600
> From: "Jerry & Liz Moos" <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> To: "Thomas R. Adams, Jr." <kctommy@msn.com>,
> <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR]Peugeot Jerseys back at Vintage Velos
> Message-ID: <112701c2d514$4a1900d0$efddfea9@mooshome>
> References: <F170DAtTpXNrJ6LRr4Y00048d63@hotmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 14
>
> They seemed to sell out quickly only because they were in a sense
> "pre-sold". A list member solicited interest from fellow CR'ers to try to
> persuade Alex Clarke, the VV owner, to make these. Alex prefers Italian
> stuff and is anything but a Francophile. But armed with names of people who
> would by one (or two), the list member managed to persuade him. Even then,
> I heard that Alex was unhappy when some people did not follow thru on their
> verbal commitments by making actual purchases. I did my part, buying one SS
> and one LS. Not sure how often I'll wear the LS here in Houston. Maybe in
> the end they sold better than Alex thought they would, and he has had a
> change of heart about French jerseys. If that is the case, maybe someone
> should lobby him for Mercier, Lejeune or Heylett jerseys.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jerry Moos
> Houston, TX
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Thomas R. Adams, Jr." <kctommy@msn.com>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 3:22 PM
> Subject: [CR]Peugeot Jerseys back at Vintage Velos
>
>
> > While browsing for what-not, I happened to click on the jerseys page at
> Vintage Velos. Behold; the Peugeot Team jerseys that sold out seemingly in
> the blink of an eye last year are apparently back in stock!
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.vintagevelos.com/jer-peugeot1.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Grab one now before they get away again. Even if you don't own a PX10,
> you will someday, so be prepared.
> >
> >
> >
> > Tom Adams, Shrewsbury NJ
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------
> > MSN 8 with
> > ------------------------------------------
> > e-mail virus protection service:
> > ------------------------------------------
> > 2 months FREE*
> > ------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 12:12:34 -0500
> From: "Jon M. Schaer" <jschaer@columbus.rr.com>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: Re: [CR] LOOK pedals to market?
> Message-ID: <003501c2d515$79d92a60$dabcd018@columbus.rr.com>
> References: <fb.38165bc6.2b7fb098@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 15
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <OROBOYZ@aol.com>
>
> > I am fairly certain that Look and all clipless pedals are literally and
> > philosophically out of the CR time frame.. Can anyone correct my distinct
> > impression that clipless were introduced after 1983?
> >
>
> By timeline, I seem to remember that Look's were introduced IN the 1983
> season as an aftermarket product. Don't know if any were spec'd by
> manufacturers, so might not be "period correct" for an '83 model bike. But
> philosophically, I do have to say they feel out-of-place, even if there were
> other clipless systems available. I still see those as the first step in the
> link to modern bikes, as I believe index shifting came a year later. Should
> we dig out those old road tests?
>
> Jon Schaer
> Columbus, OH
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 11:15:40 -0600
> From: "Jerry & Liz Moos" <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <chasds@mindspring.com>, "Brandon Ives" <monkeylad@mac.com>
> Cc: oroboyz@aol.com
> Cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: Re: [CR]CR list time-period limits
> Message-ID: <116201c2d515$ddbbb110$efddfea9@mooshome>
> References: <4F20D742-3D6C-11D7-B012-00039356BD92@mac.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> Precedence: list
> Message: 16
>
> Fortunately, Dale has been pretty flexible with the cutoff date. My 1986
> Peugeot PZ-10 is technically outside the cutoff, but he posted the photos on
> the CR site. And Rivendell, Sachs, Baylis, Bohemian, Bates, Cooper,
> Mercian, etc. are all most definitely accepted, even if built last month.
> It's really about the style and spirit of the bike, but since it is
> impossible to define a rule in those terms, I think the real rule is before
> 1983 plus anything else Dale deems acceptable. Works for me.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jerry Moos
> Houston, TX
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Brandon Ives" <monkeylad@mac.com>
> To: <chasds@mindspring.com>
> Cc: <oroboyz@aol.com>; <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 8:55 PM
> Subject: Re: [CR]CR list time-period limits
>
>
> > On Monday, February 10, 2003, at 09:36 PM, chasds@mindspring.com wrote:
> > > There were many fine classic bikes, by any standard, made between
> > > 1980 and 1984...
> >
> > I think it might have more to do with the explosion of mountain bikes
> > and the decline of the lightweight and not really the death of friction
> > shifting of non-aero cable routing. Also you've got to remember index
> > shifting actually came before friction shifting. Personally I think
> > the list should stop at about 1970 and the US bicycle boom. I think
> > bike quality plummeted to bring the numbers of bikes up to fill sales.
> > Beyond that anything in the 70s or after is really contemporary not
> > really "classic." A majority of the list talks about bikes of the 70s
> > and 80s because that's when most of the list became associated with
> > cycling. It's a nostalgia thing not a quality thing. Of course this
> > is coming from someone who started cycling in the bike boom but wasn't
> > a teenager until 1982. So what do I know, except that dale is right
> > when he say's everybody has different ideas about the "cut-off date."
> > ciao,
> > Brandon"monkeyman"Ives
> > SB, CA
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> End of Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 2, Issue 64
> ************************************************