[CR]Is there such a thing as a wraparound seat stay?

(Example: Framebuilding:Paint)

From: "Norris Lockley" <Norris.Lockley@btopenworld.com>
To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 00:28:57 +0100
Subject: [CR]Is there such a thing as a wraparound seat stay?

Apart from the well-known wrap-overs fabricated by very many frame-builders and possibly most developed by the British builders in the late 40s and early 50s and then carried on by many others, the nearest wrapover to the full wrapover must be the extremely crude one developed and used bt both Raleigh and Carlton extensively.

In this instance the metal of the round seat stay was virtually swaged into a tube of much smaller diameter with a thicker wall, over a length of perhaps 2" or so. This part was then curved over the top of the seat lug from both sides and joined in the centre by what appeared at times to be fusion butt welding. Generally the joint was left unfinished from the weld, resulting in a shoddy appearance.

The full wrap-over plate was perhaps the means by which the hand-builder could just about achieve a full wrap-over - the plate curving continuously from one side of the lug to the other. However the seat stays themselves finished high on the sides of the lugs and didn't normally meet.

On a few occasions I have manufactured a full wrapover from solid bar that has been milled down, rather on the style of some early Italian eyes, with the each end of the wrapover being turned and shouldered to be brazed into the ends of the deat stays themselves. While this type can be made to look extremely attractive, they tend to work out to be very heavy in comparison with the plated variety.

On reflection I suppose the Italian cast seat lug of the 50s and 60s with its seat stay eyes already cast in-situ comes nearest to the full wrap-over, but even this relies on the stub ends of the eyes being brazed into the upper ends of the seat stays.

Norris Lockley... counting up my boxful of full wrap-over plates as shown on the CR web-site. Any takers over there?