Re: [CR]Record calipers are Record calipers


Example: Events:Cirque du Cyclisme:2004

To: tom_s_dalton@yahoo.com
Date: Mon, 21 Jun 2004 15:48:25 -0400
Subject: Re: [CR]Record calipers are Record calipers
From: Richard M Sachs <richardsachs@juno.com>
cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org

snipped: "This is all the more probable because most folks never gave a hoot about

historical accuracy and having this year's brake lever wasn't always as essential as it seems to be today."

amen, brother. e-RICHIE aka Richard Sachs seated next to wm shattner in chester, ct

On Mon, 21 Jun 2004 12:28:54 -0700 (PDT) Tom Dalton <tom_s_dalton@yahoo.com> writes:
>
> Wow, there sure does seem to be lot of confusion surrounding the
> difference(s) between SR and Nuovo calipers. Seems like a lot of
> folks have theories, some of which are wrong, at least according
> to Mr. White. I can see where there is a lot of room for confusion,
> because I can think of at least 8 different Record calipers, not
> including the 50th Anniversary and Cobalto models*. Given how bike
> parts can be mixed and matched over time (in the shop, by the
> owner), any of these calipers might appear on a bike with any of
> several Record (at least 4 types) and Super Record (at least 3
> types) levers. This is all the more probable because most folks
> never gave a hoot about historical accuracy and having this
> years brake lever wasnt always as essential as it seems to be
> today. Beyond doing what Chuck does, which is to review old
> catalogs, the only other reasonably definitive assessment of
> differences between SR and Nuovo would involve looking at what
> came in the blue and
> yellow boxes back in the day. With that as my guide, Ill stick my
> neck out and say that there never, ever was a bit of difference
> between what came in the blue box and what came in the yellow box.
> Yes, there were alloy and steel holders, block and script logos,
> etc., etc., but at any given time, the boxes that were blue and the
> boxes that were yellow left Vicenza with the all same parts inside
> except the lever part of the brake lever assembly.
>
>
>
> It is probably of little interest to most of you, but there are
> actually two different types of Record alloy shoe holder.... well,
> really there are at least four... but the two basic types are
> different in that the early ones were roughly the same dimensions as
> the old steel holders (remember how heavy they were, so slow on the
> climbs ;-). As Steven mentioned they tended to break. In fact, I
> had six of them as of a few weeks ago, but when I tried to
> straighten some that had squished down at the tire guide, two of the
> guides broke off. Having only one complete set left, I didnt
> attempt any more straightening. Anyway, they were weak and would
> break if you grabbed them to compress the caliper (as when attaching
> the cable). The solution was a redesign with a wider tire guide.
> It was almost twice as wide where the guide meets the main part of
> the holder. They are much, much, more common than the skinny break
> away model.
>
>
>
> As for my comment that there were actually four types of alloy
> holder... well, some but not all of the skinny holders had the
> markings reversed on one side so the left and right shoes would be
> mirror image, rather than having two-fold axial symmetry like all
> the earlier steel models and all the later beefed-up alloy models.
> The fourth type is the beefed-up alloy model with the gray plastic
> that came on later Cobaltos, though not the very early ones, which
> were black.
>
>
>
> *Record Caliper types: 1) 1st gen no logo, 2) early type with
> Brev. center bolt, 3) the typical pre-CPSC flat QR type, 4) the
> early post-CPSC type with plastic coated steel shoe holders, domed
> QR and the old style cam typically associated with the pre-CPSC flat
> QR, 5) the same as 4, but with the newer cam that reads Camp.
> Instead of having Campagnolo spelled out around the perimeter 6)
> like type 5, but with skinny alloy shoe holders, 7) last of the
> block logo type, just like type 6, but having the beefed up alloy
> holder, and 8) the very common script logo type. Note that there
> are likely more variations within the rare early models (types 1 and
> 2), but who ever gets to see them? Also, I would speculate that the
> difference between 4 and 5 is likely the result of tooling changes
> sometime around the CPSC changeover. As another twist, I have short
> reach arms that are marked Brev. Inter just like all the normal
> arms Ive seen, while the vast majority of short reach arms
> seem to be marked Brev. Int. So this is another change that I
> think took place around the time of the CPSC changes. If the change
> in the markings did not coincide with one of the other changes, that
> makes 9 versions. Its tough for me to nail down this nuance, as
> far as when it took place relative to other changes, and whether
> there was switching back and forth through time. This is because
> the only Brev. Inter. short reach arms I have did not come to me
> on assembled calipers so I have no clear idea of how late they may
> have appeared... it could have been strictly a pre-CPSC thing.
>
>
>
> Finally (really) regarding the late levers that Lou D. and Karen R.
> mentioned: Lou, I know for certain that circa 1987 some very late
> SR brakesets came through with the white shield logo hoods normally
> found in Victory levers. These sets also came with pearl white
> housings and 1.6mm wires normally associated with Cobalto and later
> brakesets (Chorus, Delta, Athena). Ann, the shield logo drilled-out
> non-aero lever was the Victory lever. I dont doubt that Campy may
> have shipped some very, very late SR sets with those levers, but it
> was originally from the Victory group.
>
>
>
> Tom Dalton
>
> Bethlehem, PA
>
>
>
>
>
>
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