Re: [CR]Ilkeston vs Worksop Raleigh Team Pro Questions

(Example: Production Builders:Cinelli)

From: <"">
Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 00:29:18 GMT
Subject: Re: [CR]Ilkeston vs Worksop Raleigh Team Pro Questions

i'm confused and sedated... jan legrand was in the team organization. wouldn't he have built any frames made in holland? he help g.o.d. in england early on in the team frame design. no? e-RICHIE chester, ct

-- Fred Rafael Rednor wrote:

Peter, I'm thoroughly confused about this, too. But that's because by the time I really followed the Raleigh professional cycling team it seemed to be based in the Nederlands. Or were there 2 distinct teams: one UK based and the other a basically a Dutch team? One reason I ask is because I was under the impression the Dutch Raleigh team bikes were built (in Amsterdam?) by Peter Serier. Best regards, Fred Rednor - Arlington, Virginia
> I am thoroughly confused.
> Would that someone, anyone, would contribute a concise and
> authoratitive
> history of the Raleigh Team Professional! Either to the CR
> website or
> RetroRaleighs! I have done a thorough review of the CR List
> archives and
> whilst there has been a lot posted on the subject, it's more
> minutia than
> an overall sense of the model's history and development.
> >From what I've gleaned, the Ilkeston Special Build Unit was
> started in 1974
> and assumed all of the special custom frame making production
> formally done
> at Worksop by Carlton under Gerald Donovan. Recall that
> Raleigh acquired
> Carlton in '61 and marketed lightweights in the UK as
> Carltons and as
> Raleighs in the US (with the Carlton name as well). What came
> out of
> Ilkeston was 100 per cent Raleigh for both the UK and export
> with Donovan
> heading the new unit.
> I believe the TI Raleigh Team started in what 1972?? This
> took over from
> the Carlton team I believe. Previous postings by Richard
> Sachs prove that
> they were racing TI Raleigh Pros at the time which I assume
> were initially
> built at Worksop. Yellow rather than black headtubes as I
> recall. Fastback
> stays.
> The pioneering use of Reynolds 753 begin, I think, in late
> 1974, early '75.
> It's been my understanding that henceforth only 753 was used
> for
> Ilkeston-made frames and that this was a frame only
> production either for
> the Team or special orders. I've also been told that "real"
> team bikes
> often lacked the Reynolds frame transfers. All Ilkeston-made
> frames had
> "SB" prefixed serial numbers and that true team bikes made
> for specific
> riders were also so indicated on the bottom bracket. I think
> TI Team
> machines were all Super Record fitted. 3TTT stems and bars
> until the late
> '70s and then Cinelli.
> Now, the North American catalogues list "Raleigh Team
> Professionals". But
> were these ever built at Ilkeston?? Or were they the Worksop
> made Team Pros
> that prompted Eric Elman's original query? None of the
> catalogues c.
> 1973-75 show anything but Reynolds 531 frames with no mention
> of 753. Then
> the model disappears. Did this coincide with the move to 753
> frame sets
> only from Ilkeston? Were these Worksop Team Pros essentially
> then
> Professionals with SR rather than NR components and the team
> livery??
> Whereas the Ilkeston-made 753 frames were rather more
> special. And lots
> more money.
> This was certainly the case in the early 1980s when Raleigh
> Team Pro
> framesets were in the catalogue. I believe in 1983 Cycling
> Magazine
> (UK)nominated the machine as its top bike of the year.
> Anyway, I am sure there are folks here who know more and
> better than I.
> With the indulgence of people who couldn't give a toss about
> these
> machines, a few more exchanges might yield an outline of the
> real story and
> something that can be cobbled together into a useful and
> accurate history.
> So someone tell me I am full of crap and set the story
> straight once and
> for all. Please.
> Peter Kohler
> Washington DC USA
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