[CR]1940's lugless Claud Butler models, and thanks

(Example: Bike Shops)

Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2005 07:52:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Michael Davies" <msdavi59@yahoo.com>
To: Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Subject: [CR]1940's lugless Claud Butler models, and thanks

This is a followup to my earlier request for help identifying a lugless model which several list members had suggested might be a Holdsworth La Quelda. The consensus now seems to be that it's not a La Quelda, and is possibly a Claud Butler (this was my recollection, too, from memories of the frame from 40 years ago before it lost its transfers and headbadge). If the bike is indeed a Claud, the serial number suggests that it might be a 1942 model, hence I've been trying to match it up to models in Norm Kilgariff's online 1940/41 catalog. The problem is that it doesn't exactly match any of the models shown, in terms of geometry. As far as I can make out, there were three lugless models offered in this catalog, the 'Mass Start', the 'Sport Anglais', and possibly the 'Continental Classic', (although it's not clear to me whether this one was lugless or not). Does anyone know if there were other lugless models offered during this time.

The particulars on my model are: Seat tube angle 74 degrees Head tube angle 74 degrees 40.5" wheelbase 2" bottom bracket drop 19" seat tube length 21" top tube length.

As far as I can see, none of the CB models offered match these specs in terms of geometry....mine is a much more upright frame, and yet it's fitted out like a tourer, with tabs for luggage rack and lamps front and rear. Also, it's extremely light.....under 20lbs in it's current incarnation, and even with some of the older, heavier components shown in the catalog, it's hard to imagine it approaching the mid-20's weights quoted in the catalog for most of the models. The Hyperlite Tourer model came to mind...it's about the right weight, but it looks like a lugged model.

I'd also like to extend my thanks to list members, particularly Frank Ellingford and Doug Smith, for offering their insights and stimulating discussion. Also, thanks to Cliff Scheiner for his initial help several months ago.

If anyone is interested, links to pics of the bike appear below..

Regards - Michael Davies St Louis, MO

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Frame1.jpg This is a left side view of the disassembled frame and fork.

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Frame2.jpg This is a rear view of the disassembled frame and fork.

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Frame3.jpg This is a right side view of the disassembled frame and fork.

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Rear_dropout.jpg This is a view of the Chater Lea rear dropouts. Dropout spacing is 115mm

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Bottom_bracket1.jpg This is a left side view of the bottom bracket shell. Visible is the incorrect spindle; the BB shell width is 63.5mm and the spindle is from a 68mm BB. Not visible is the interior of the BB shell….it’s fully enclosed, with no openings to the intersecting tubes.

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Bottom_bracket2.jpg An underside view of the bottom bracket. The serial number is clearly visible.

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Fork_rear.jpg A view of the backside of the front fork. Again, the serial number can be seen.

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Fork_tip.jpg A view of the front fork dropouts. Dropout spacing is 90mm

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Seatpost.jpg A view of the underside of the intersection of the top tube, seat tube and seatstays.

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Frame_forward.jpg A close-up view of the front part of the frame

http://home.att.net/~michael.s.davies/Frame_rear.jpg A close-up view of the rear of the frame.

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