RE: [CR]E-bay-based scam

(Example: Framebuilding:Technology)

From: "RB" <>
To: "CR" <>
Subject: RE: [CR]E-bay-based scam
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 23:36:46 -0700
In-Reply-To: <>

Good info. Sorry to hear about what happened. Please forward your information to the FBI internet fraud dept: Also Google the appropriate authorities in Germany. That is a place to start. At a minimum they can shut down his site. You need to complain, because it often takes more than one person's complaint before they do anything. They can backtrack him through his ISP, and share the info with the International authorities, who will often do something if victims make enough noise. In addition, if the FBI does not follow up in a couple of weeks, e-mail me back off-list. Meantime, this Masi is an ebay auction - you must complain to them, and get his auction pulled and his account shut down, even if they don't refund your money. You are going to have to make a huge stink with ebay to get this done, but it will be worth it.

NEVER send money to ANY internet seller via Western Union!! This is a known scammer tactic, and is rife with fraud. Use PayPal via credit or debit card, or walk away. IMO, BidPay sucks. Even PayPal is not 100%, but it does have some advantages.

Further beware of Ebay Second Chance offers via e-mail. This is another known fraud tactic. Any legitimate second chance offer should show up in your 'My Ebay' account page, but I'm not 100% sure of this.

If in doubt, pay via credit or debit card via PayPal, and you can always get the card company to cancel the transaction within 30 days, and refund your money. If the seller says they don't take credit/debit transactions, be wary. Sometimes it's just because they have a personal PayPal account, and can't accept these transactions. If you pay this way anyway, PayPal makes them get a Premier account before they can recieve the funds. Then they are Premier for evermore, and subject to a 3% fee on every transaction, even if it's a bank account transfer. If this is a payment for an auction win, they can run afoul of Ebay rules, and damage their feedback in the ensuing mess (i.e. you paid, but they refuse your payment - an ebay rules violation, you complain, and feedback is damaged by you, and/or ebay suspends their account for violating the PayPal and seller fulfillment Ebay rule(s)).

This is often because they don't want to setup a Premier account, usually because they don't want to pay the 3% fees on every transaction. Occasionally but rarely, it's because they are scamming. IMO tho, they are not a serious seller if they try to do it this way just to save the 3%. It puts the buyer at risk by having to pay via money order or bank transfer, which then leaves PayPal as the only source of rememdy if the goods are bad or not delivered. This can work out in favor of the buyer, but does not always. Either way, it's often slow. You can cancel money orders from US Postal, but again, this can get sticky, and does not always work out.

PayPal and Ebay which owns them do it this way on purpose, to generate more fees for themselves, and to shift the burden to the credit card companies if something goes wrong, who then write it off as bad debt. While the bank transfer method can sometimes provide PayPal buyer protection, it does not always (I don't know the specifics of when it does and does not).

I personally will never buy from a seller that won't accept credit/debit cards via paypal. Often just because I know I can just call my card company and cancel the transaction by phone anytime within 30 days if I need to. The seller is protected from reverse fraud this way to some extent, also by the card company.

Bill Roberts Jacksonville, OR

-----Original Message----- From: []On Behalf Of dan stoner Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2005 10:40 PM To: Subject: [CR]E-bay-based scam

Hi Folks: Just a note about a scammer operating with impunity this very day. I'm a little humiliated to reveal this because it shows my ignorance when I was brand new at E-bay purchases. Nonetheless, I want to educate others as to what's going on & warn you not to deal with a known con artist. Right now, you may notice two bikes currently listed on E-bay by a "mogulpal". One is a Masi, the other a Gios (here's a like to the Masi:<blah> QQitemZ7184272394QQcategoryZ98084QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem I dealt with Mogulpal several months ago- bid on his Gios, didn't win it as it never reached reserve. Contacted Mogulpal thru E-Bay after the auction about a "second chance" purchase option. MogulPal sent me bogus e-mails appearing to be from E-Bay notifying me I'd won the bike & asked me to send money by Western Union, as his Paypal acct was down. In reviewing Mogulpal's 100% E-Bay record, I assumed it was safe to deal with him. His scam E-bay notification also stated that he had money in an escrow account to insure the buyer's satisfaction. After paying the money by WU, the bike was never shipped. When I emailed Mogulpal, he continually claimed that he had mistakenly shipped two bikes to me instead of one, and asked me to send another chunk of $ so he could have the second one released to me. E-Bay refused to do anything about this con game, because it happened off of E-Bay. Authorities have done nothing either. Turns out that MogulPal has a site ( chock full of juicy bikes & parts, ready to entice a trusting buyer to send money. He generally claims the bikes are in Los Altos, CA, but he is located in Germany. MogulPal's given name could be Luchas Frand or Johannes Steilmann of Hamburg. Sorry about the long e-mail, but I don't want anyone else to get conned by this thief. Dan Harold Denver, CO

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