Re: [CR]Fwd: "Mudguards" in German


Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2005 10:20:38 +0100
From: Freek Faro <khun.freek@gmail.com>
To: ternst <ternst1@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [CR]Fwd: "Mudguards" in German
In-Reply-To: <029601c5f549$2602c2a0$0200a8c0@D8XCLL51>
References: <285.a209d6.30be2bcb@aol.com>
cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org

Ted, Toni,

This discussion reminds me of Ted's post some months ago, about 'step' (road and track step). When I started racing around 1980, the Dutch term wa s 'tred': 'baantred', or just 'tred'. This is what I 'acquired' or kept by cycling to and from work in the winter, when training is really limited to the weekends. In Dutch 'tred' is not used often, but a step of a stairway i s a 'trede'. Toni, would that be 'tritt' in German? Let's explore some more similarities!

Freek Faro Rotterdam Netherlands

2005/11/30, ternst <ternst1@cox.net>:
>
> In support of Toni, Kot as he defines it could have meant exactly the mix
> of
> animal excrement and mud, The horse and buggy days weren't always the
> "good
> 'ol days".
> Schaltwerk could be translated as shift mechanism,
> Umwerfer as "over thrower". For the front derailleur.
> Schutzblech is "protective (sheet) metal. Weather plastic or wood or othe r
> the term is generic in its' usage and understanding
> Please keep in mind that English as we know it today is an amalgam of
> Angle,
> Saxon, Celt, Norse, French especially after 1066, plus all the other
> distinct languages of the Isles, etc.
> That's why it's so much fun to see how our cycling terminology has evlove d
> from countries of origin, and their local usage compared to ours.
> Ted Ernst
> Palos Verdes Estates, CA
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <OROBOYZ@aol.com>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 2:10 PM
> Subject: [CR]Fwd: "Mudguards" in German
>
>
> > In a message dated 11/29/2005 3:29:47 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> > toni.theilmeier@t-online.de writes:
> >
> > <<
> > > Sheldon Brown <CaptBike@sheldonbrown.com> wrote:
> > > Aside from the oft-abused "gruppo" I'm at a loss...
> > > Pedal is from Italy(it's from Latin)Much of the German,French,and
> > > English language is from Italy.
> > > sam lingo(that's lingo from the gaelic french word not the italian
> > > one)
> > > pleasanton tx
> >
> > I´m sorry to have to contradict you there as far as the German langua ge
> > is concerned.
> >
> > Many of the early words came from English as of course the English more
> > or less invented the bike industry. Words were imported along with
> > parts and bikes, only that my forbears then went ahead and translated
> > those English words into German, sometimes rather crudely.
> >
> > The same then was true for later additions needed because of technical
> > developments, such as "Schaltwerk" or "Umwerfer". Quite clear that
> > these are original German words, they are rear mech and front
> > derailleur respectively. Then you have "Schutzblech", which literally
> > means protection sheet metal, but don´t start thinking this has come
> > off a tank, it´s our beloved mudguard, fender, garde-boue. Funnily
> > enough, you can also use this expression for mudguards made from
> > plastic. Prime example of a structurally protected expression.
> >
> > The original word again came from England. In the 1890s people
> > translated it into "Kotschützer", "Kot" then meaning just mud. In the
> > meantime, "Kot" has changed its meaning, as words do, to designate
> > "excrement". "Kotschützer" could have become a structurally protected
> > expression, but it hasn´t, and so has just died out.
> >
> > Regards, Toni Theilmeier, Belm, Germany. >>