Going Fast and Holistic Design (Re: [CR]Constructeurs? NOW Wave of the future)

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Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2005 09:33:06 -0800
Subject: Going Fast and Holistic Design (Re: [CR]Constructeurs? NOW Wave of the future)
To: "brianbaylis@juno.com" <brianbaylis@juno.com>
From: Brandon Ives <brandon@ivycycles.com>
In-Reply-To: <20051113.072220.11859.106046@webmail10.lax.untd.com>
cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org

I've been thinking about Brian's words and am really looking forward to seeing his creations at the show. Brian is an artist and go-fast guy at heart, and I believe comes from a different direction that most of the other people building constructeur-esque bikes right now. Brian likes pushing really big gears and going really fast and this aspect of the folks building for the technical trials seems to have been be pushed to the side in favor of touring and randonneuring. First and foremost these trials were about racing and going fast. I really love the current crop of constructeur-esque bikes since it really fits my personal riding style of adventure riding, but I'm really excited to see Brian's vision.

I'd also like folks to look a little closely at what this bike style is all about. I keep reading and hearing the bikes referred to as touring or randonneuring bikes and I don't think this is correct. As I stated above these started as racing bikes at the core. Beyond that those three descriptors were only about how they were used. I think the main thing the constructeurs brought to the table was holistic bike design. They were not thinking about a frame, they were thinking about the whole bike. The only folks still doing that seems to be Toei and a couple of the other Japanese builders. Even the few French builders, like Singer, seem to be moving away from their historical oeuvre. So from reading Brian's words I feel he really is thinking along the lines of the historical builders. 95% of framebuilders still working are just that frame builders. There really isn't anything wrong with that, but they're missing a large part of their history by not thinking holistically about the whole bike. I long for the day where 95% of the folks building are bike builders, and not just framebuilders. I hope this is where Brian can lead us as builders. best, Brandon"monkeyman"Ives Vancouver, B.C.

On Sunday, Nov 13, 2005, at 07:22 US/Pacific, brianbaylis@juno.com wrote:
> Angel,
> I have been observing the trends in the handmade bicycle market, and
> mon
> itoring my own feelings and needs for bicycles as I get older (and
> presu
> meably wiser). My conclusion is partially, but not entirely, that the
> be
> st place and most practical application for a lugged steel frame in the
> current times, considering the materials that bicycles are built from,
> i
> s for a touring, randonnuer, or fixed gear bike. There is no doubt in
> my
> mind that lugged steel racing bikes are a thing of the past for anyone
> who is seriously competative as a racer.
> As Mike mentioned, the totally custom nature of the touring bike lends
> i
> tself well to the versitility of steel frames; and beautifully crafted
> a
> nd artistic (or simple and well crafted) lugs fit in perfectly with the
> concept. A properly designed tourer will have a multitude of uses, up
> to
> and including fast and "competative" rides with your friends while
> stil
> l retaining usefulness as a utility to fetch groceries or run errands
> ar
> ound town. Needless to say, such a bicycle would be ideal for longer
> rid
> es or tours. High art and craftsmanship is at home on a randonnuer.
> Raci
> ng bikes, if lugged, are either not really raced as a rule or used
> prima
> rily for the "Sunday in the park" sort of "racing". More of a show than
> a race. This is what I obverve here in SoCal, and I doubt if it's a
> whol
> e lot different elsewhere.
> My formost reason for my opinion as to the "wave of the future" comes
> as
> a framebuilder. To build the same style and type of bike for over 30
> ye
> ars is really boring and presents no challenges and very little
> opportun
> ity for creativity and growth as a builder. The randonnuer bike opens
> up
> a whole new world for the creative thinker and designer to expand
> their
> skills and express their talents, while at the same time producing a
> us
> eful product that will stand the test of time for generations. A
> bicycle
> this unique will have lasting value both as a bicycle AND as a piece
> of
> art. Since I have always had a policy of making no two frames exactly
> a
> like, this gives me the avenue to continue this trend, but at a much
> hig
> her level. The more individual the bike is and the more one of a kind
> it
> is, the greater the value will be in the future. It's the same way
> righ
> t now with the classics we all ride and love.
> One will probably have to see what I'm talking about to fully
> understand
> completely what I'm saying. Attend the framebuilders show in March or
> t
> he Cirque in June and you will see my first entries into the randonnuer
> catagory of bicycles. Part of the wave of the future will come from the
> fortunate few who have the patience and vision to participate in this
> tr
> end and retain the services of the best designers and craftsmen in the
> b
> usiness to build the bicycle that dreams are made of. Wait and see.
> Brian Baylis
> La Mesa, CA
> -- Angel Garcia <veronaman@gmail.com> wrote:
> Brian, could you give us some insights into your reasoning as to why
> constructuer bikes are the way of the future?
> Angel Garcia
> Verona, Italy
> snip:
>> my interest and attention have turned to randonnuer type bikes.
>> Brian Baylis
>> La Mesa, CA
>> I know it will take some time to take hold; but pay attention.
>> Constructuer bikes are the wave of the future!