Having recently received a frame from Peter I can tell you the packing job was really exceptional. Several other regular sellers I buy from are conscientious and pack well but Peter went above and beyond. To do that takes time and I have no problem with providing reasonable compensation for this. No one wants to pay more than they have to for shipping but in these days of increased charges and fuel tariffs it's a reality. That doesnt mean we should expect the seller to arrange all of the packing and logistics for nothing to offset what the shipping companies are charging. As far as I'm concerned the sale price of an item covers only the purchase of the item and if I'm not willing to pick the item up then for those sellers willing to go to the trouble of packing and often delivering the item to the shipping hub to keep the cost down, I'm more than happy to compensate them. It's a different story if the charge is usurious. I also appreciate sellers who are willing to investigate alternative shipping sources in an effort to help keep the cost down. It's worth remembering that a reliable seller will also be there for you in the event of a problem and if the shipment goes astray or if there are damage issues and follow up for tracking and insurance claims are needed. They end up spending additional time trying to sort that all out. That takes more effort on their part and is worth something so I feel that fair compensation is money well spent.
Edward Robert Brooks Managing Director Edward Roberts International Auctioneers of the Fine and Rare 1262 West Winwood Drive Lake Forest, Illinois 60045 Phone- 847.295.8696 Facsimile- 847.295.8697 Email- ebrooks@eriwine.com Website- http://www.eriwine.com
-----Original Message----- From: classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org [mailto:classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org] On Behalf Of Peter Brown Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2006 3:04 PM To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]Rant on International payments
Phil Seig writes: Of course, if a seller wishes to use p&p as a separate profit center...
As a regular UK seller of frames, allow me to give you some facts, based
on my own experience.
I charge a flat shipping charge of £75 for frames to the USA. If I am lucky, I can get one of the very light boxes from my local bike shop (those made in Vietnam such as Saracen are usually the lightest), and then if the frame is a Reynolds throughout, I can get the package under 6½ Kg, and
the cost will be just under £60. If it is a heavier frame, and I have to use one of the British made heavier boxes, the weight will be over 8Kg, and the cost about £70. For my £5 to £15 profit, I have to:
Go to town and scrounge the best box I can find.
Re-make it to fit within the now very strictly enforced Parcelforce limits.
Pack the frame on the assumption that it is going to be on the bottom of
a container, and that the delivery man is going to walk all over the box (and I have seen that happen!)
Spend at least £5 on suitable packing material, light enough to keep the cost down, and strong enough to make it bomb proof.
Complete all the paperwork and deliver it to the Post Office, having spent a total of about 3 hours on the total job.
So, you see, the profit soon vanishes, and I doubt if Peter McCleod will see any on the frames that he is selling. Buyers should be more concerned with the quality of the packing and the service they receive. There is little point in spending £400+ on a rare and possibly irreplaceable frame, and then trying to beat the seller down to a cheap and inadequate packing job.
And if you think shipping from the UK is expensive now, have a look at the volumetric calculations on the Parceforce website, which for the time being can be skipped, but which will probably lead to shipping costs of £105
and upwards from August.
Peter Brown. Lincolnshire. England.