Michael and Kim,
Thanks for your interesting information. It's impressive that this group ca n solve such a riddle!
The one mystery that remains with this bike is where the 'World Championshi p' and 'B' pantographed Record parts come from, and what they are referring to...
Best,
Wyndham Pulman-Jones Girton, Cambs., UK.
On Monday, October 02, 2006, at 01:58PM, kim klakow <Akimbo71@gmx.net> wrot
e:
>Hi Michael, Hello Wyndham,
>
>I am sorry to say that although the info is very welcome, the fork is an E
nik. They equipped the german national teams in the 70s. Nice bikes. I ride
an early 90s aluminum one with a steel fork sporting this exact same logo.
A good daily.
>Best,
>kim
>
>
>
>
>-------- Original-Nachricht --------
>Datum: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 12:05:32 +0200
>Von: "Michael Schmid" <schmid@zunterer.com>
>An: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org, simonpj@mac.com
>Betreff: [CR]AW: Fake bianchi
>
>> Hello Wyndham,
>> The engraving in the fork-crown could also be read as ES. As the seller
>> of the bike lives in Wolfratshausen near Munich this would point to a
>> local bike brand and store of Edi Strobl in Brunnthal. As far as I know
>> Edi Strobl is a former racer and has a nice shop for some years now. The
>> shop marketed his own frames under the ES brand mainly in the seventies
>> and eighties and probably aluminium frames today. . I think their frames
>> were ordered at some of the bigger makers in close nothern italy. I have
>> seen at least one steelframe with a different ES engraving at the fork
>> crown. The script was more modern so the bike you have could be older. A
>> lot of those bikes came in fancy cromovelato finish, which goes together
>> with the chrome/nickel plating your frame. I remember those translucent
>> finishes being very nice new but not very solid. The pint chipped off
>> easily so someone might just have removed the rest of the finish to gain
>> the chrome look. As the shop still exists you can contact them via
>> radsportstrobl@gmx.de
>> and might get some detailed informations. It is no wonder that the bike
>> sports Bianchi stickers since a former distributor sold a lot of sticker
>> sets recently via the Internet. You can buy them almost alway on german
>> ebay.
>>
>> Best regard
>>
>> Michael Schmid
>> Oberammergau
>> Germany
>> mail: schmid@zunterer.com
>> http://www.zunterer.com
>>
>> -
>>
>> Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 11:28:21 +0100
>> From: Simon PJ <simonpj@mac.com>
>> To: Simon PJ <simonpj@mac.com>, <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
>> Subject: [CR]Help ID fake Bianchi - detailed pics
>> Message-ID: <C14556D5.2AC29%simonpj@mac.com>
>> In-Reply-To: <C1447A1E.2ABB4%simonpj@mac.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>> MIME-Version: 1.0
>> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>> Precedence: list
>> Message: 7
>>
>> I have added more detailed photos of the 'fake' Bianchi that I bought
>> recently from a German eBay seller:
>>
>> http://www.wooljersey.com/
>>
>> I have no reason to believe that the seller was trying to deceive by
>> listing the bike as a Bianchi - especially given that the price was not
>> high.
>>
>> The bike is clearly a mix of parts from different dates; the frame
>> looking to be end of 70's to early 80's (with top tube brake cable
>> braze-ons), with the Campy parts spanning early to mid 70's.
>>
>> The date mark on the cranks is 5 in a diamond - I assume that that is
>> for 1975. The rear derailleur is marked Patent 73, and I believe the
>> brakes are early 70's. I can't see any date marks on the Record hub
>> lock-nuts, .
>>
>> I would be very grateful for any information that list members might be
>> able to shed on the pantographing on the Nuovo record parts.
>>
>> The pantographing on the large chainring (with matching colours in the
>> drilling on the brake calipers) would seem to be celebrating a World
>> Championship relating to a 'B'. It's not the Bianchi 'B' - so what 'B'
>> might this be referring to? (I have posted a detailed photo on Wool
>> Jersey).
>>
>> Can anyone shed any light on the identity of the frame? I have posted
>> detailed photos of the logos engraved in the tops of the fork crown, and
>> of the lugs and BB shell.
>>
>> The serial number on the BB shell reads, small zero, then larger digits,
>> 032700. At right angles to this number is "X 7" on the front side of the
>> BB shell.
>>
>> Thanks in advance for any suggestions!
>>
>> Wyndham Pulman-Jones
>> Girton, Cambs.,
>> UK.
>>
>> On 30/9/06 19:46, "Simon PJ" <simonpj@mac.com> wrote:
>>
>> > A couple of weeks ago I noticed a message posted by Steven Maasland
>> > which outed an eBay auction for what purported to be a chrome framed
>> > Bianchi sporting some interesting Nuovo Record parts. The Buy-It-Now
>> > price was a very reasonable 289 Euros. I bought it. (Steven had
>> > alerted me to the fact that the bike was not a Bianchi, but the price
>> > seemed fair for the parts
>> > alone.)
>> >
>> > The auction page can be found under Ebay item #190029479525. I have
>> > also posted the photos to Wool Jersey
>> > (http://www.wooljersey.com/gallery/simonpj/)
>> >
>> > The bike arrived yesterday. The seller was very pleasant to deal with,
>>
>> > had packed the bike well, and after its journey from Germany to
>> > England it arrived in good shape. To the last part, the bike was
>> > spotlessly clean.
>> >
>> > The main mystery is the frame. Clearly not a Bianchi, the frame is
>> > lightweight, has fairly fine lugs, and contributes to a total bike
>> > weight of about 22 pounds. The fork and rear triangle do appear to be
>> > chromed, but the main triangle doesn't look like chrome to me - though
>>
>> > it is very shiny. Could it be the nickel plating that was underneath
>> > the original paint finish?
>> >
>> > There are markings on each side of the fork crown from which the
>> > letters S and D can be identified, plus one other possible letter
>> > which looks like a backwards B linking the smaller S and D. I will
>> > post more detailed photos to Wool Jersey tomorrow.
>> >
>> > The chain rings are elaborately pantographed with rainbow colours and
>> > a B which is not the Bianchi B, and the brakes are also neatly drilled
>>
>> > and filled with rainbow colours.
>> >
>> > The 26.4mm Nuovo Record seat pin was the wrong size - it should be
>> > 26.8mm. The wheels are GP4's on Record hubs, fitted with new Wolber
>> > tubs. New bars and stem have been fitted, along with Mavic brake
>> > levers which I found very uncomfortable on the first ride that I had
>> > on the bike today.
>> >
>> > I'll post more photos tomorrow to Wool Jersey, in the hope that
>> > someone might be able to identify the frame.
>> >
>> > Wyndham Pulman-Jones
>> > Girton, Cambs.,
>> > UK.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 11:47:16 +0100
>> From: Simon PJ <simonpj@mac.com>
>> To: <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
>> Subject: [CR]BB with 2 adjustable cups?
>> Message-ID: <C1455B44.2AC2B%simonpj@mac.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>> MIME-Version: 1.0
>> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>> Precedence: list
>> Message: 8
>>
>> I failed to mention in my previous post about the 'fake' Bianchi that
>> the bottom bracket is a type that I do not recognise (which appears to
>> be very well made), with adjustable cups on both sides.
>>
>> Is this type of BB intended to allow adjustment of the chain-line?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Wyndham Pulman-Jones
>> Girton, Cambs.,
>> UK.
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 13:17:00 +0100
>> From: "Joe King" <joeking@fastmail.fm>
>> To: "Simon PJ" <simonpj@mac.com>
>> Cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
>> Subject: Re: [CR]BB with 2 adjustable cups?
>> Message-ID: <1159705020.21896.272263478@webmail.messagingengine.com>
>> In-Reply-To: <C1455B44.2AC2B%simonpj@mac.com>
>> References: <C1455B44.2AC2B%simonpj@mac.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"
>> MIME-Version: 1.0
>> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>> Precedence: list
>> Message: 9
>>
>> Hello Wyndham
>> Sounds like a sealed unit bottom bracket assembly that slides in and is
>> held in place by two lock-rings. Yes you can alter the chain line on
>> these type very fractionally. Typical makes are Bador and
>> Nadax-Favorit which fall within the CR time line 1981.
>> Does anyone have any trouble answering emails to siscom and AOL users?
>> Have tried to contact the List Master and Aldo several times and they
>> keep bouncing back? Croeso Cymru Joe King Nr. Maenaddwyn Ynys Mon Wales
>>
>> --
>> http://www.fastmail.fm - Choose from over 50 domains or use your own
>>
>> -
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>
>--
>Kim Klakow
>
>Diplom Grafik Designer
>Akimbo71@gmx.net
>+49172-1786481
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