[CR]Re: Rearward opening "drop-outs".

Example: Production Builders:Peugeot:PY-10

From: "Bicycle Specialties" <mike@bikespecialties.com>
To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
References: <MONKEYFOODcxY8kiBgo00001651@monkeyfood.nt.phred.org>
Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2006 15:39:09 -0700
Subject: [CR]Re: Rearward opening "drop-outs".

Joe King wrote: Really a very simple reason for track ends they give you a greater range of gear ratios than road drop outs I would have thought this was self evident to any cyclist?

Well it is not evident to me and I consider myself a bit of a cyclist. It obviously wasn't evident to a guy named Fausto Coppi who I understand was a bit of a cyclist in his day. Coppi's track bike had Campag "Paris-Roubaix' drop-outs fitted with the teeth filed out. They had the advantage of being longer (55 mm) than the Campag 1010 road drop-outs (40 mm). The Campag track drop-outs were 44 mm which is longer than many of the rearward opening drop-outs available today. My point is that current day builders of single gear bikes have had rearward opening drop-outs made with eyelets where forward opening would be far more practical, providing of course that the slots are reasonably long..

If you are using 1" pitch this is especially so. Mudguard eyes on track bikes? Do you mean road-path or road-track which were popular deacades ago?

No I mean the current builders who follow fashion rather than stopping to think, much as the Brits did in the fifties and sixties with their road/path bikes.

Mike Barry.
Brazing in drop-outs in Toronto.

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2006 2:43 PM
Subject: Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 46, Issue 73

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> CR
> Today's Topics:
> 1. eRichie's Masi -- Reality Sets In (David Patrick)
> 2. Re: Bianchi track frames: Gipiemme fork ends? (Mark Ritz)
> 3. Rearward opening rear "Drop-out". (Bicycle Specialties)
> 4. Re: [RE]outing of Lambert bicycle
> 5. Re: FS: Campy NR/SR brake flat QR's Sold
> 6. Re: Rearward opening rear "Drop-out".
> 7. For Sale vintage Dura ace parts groupo (Phil Scott)
> 8. Japanese leather bicycle accessories (Bob Hanson)
> 9. clarification: Re: [CR]Bianchi track frames: Gipiemme fork ends?
> (Pete Geurds)
> 10. Re: Rearward opening rear "Drop-out". (Joe King)
> 11. Leather Brake lever hoods from Japan (cnighbor)
> 12. Re: Leather Brake lever hoods from Japan (Steven Willis)
> 13. Re: Leather Brake lever hoods from Japan (Tim Victor)
> 14. Re: Rearward opening rear "Drop-out". (Sheldon Brown)
> 15. San Rensho FS on Denver Craigslist (Gear)
> 16. bike sightings (Ken Bensinger)
> 17. Shared Brit bikes to view (Peter Brown)
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2006 12:05:43 -0700 (PDT)
> From: David Patrick <patrick-ajdb@sbcglobal.net>
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: [CR]eRichie's Masi -- Reality Sets In
> Message-ID: <20061019190543.33879.qmail@web82303.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> In-Reply-To:
> <101920061838.17412.4537C6250008CD71000044042205889116020E000A9C9D0A08@comcast.net>
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> The highest bid last spring on Richard's Masi was very generous and it
> seems Richard should have offered the bike up back then to the highest
> bidder. Mike Kone is spot on when he reminds us that this is a restored
> example, even if it is a rare variation, and as such, the discriminating
> buyer will most likely not pay as much for this item as he would an all
> original, mint example. I've had a chance to see in person one the NOS
> Masi GCs that John Barron sold and this thing was definitely talking to
> me, as it was dead-on, but still had the correct "smell", so to speak,
> that a restored bike wouldn't have. The high price seen earlier on
> Richad's Masi was no doubt due in part to "the cult of eRichie", which
> caused bidders to place special value on Richard's ownership of the bike.
> It now seems that perhaps some cult members have been successfully
> deprogrammed and will no longer be seen at airports selling Richard's red
> & white jerseys.
> Dave Patrick
> Chelsea, Michigan USA
> ------------------------------
> Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2006 12:13:06 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Mark Ritz <ritzmon@sbcglobal.net>
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: [CR]Re: Bianchi track frames: Gipiemme fork ends?
> Message-ID: <20061019191306.95650.qmail@web83106.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> In-Reply-To: <MONKEYFOODRKbpG1Kia000015f5@monkeyfood.nt.phred.org>
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> There were two levels of Bianchi track bikes in the 80's, the Super Pista
> (full campy with campy ends in chrome IIRC and full Columbus PS tubeset)
> and the Eco-Pista (Gipiemme group, Columbus tretubi frame). The geometry
> was very similiar if not the same, and the Eco-Pista was a popular
> entry-level track bike in my old store in San Marino, CA.
> Cheers,
> Mark (Pista) Ritz
> The other end of the state from San Marino in Arcata, CA, USA
> Pete wrote:
> Questions for owners of early 80's Bianchi track frames:
> Did they use Gipiemme track fork ends (dropouts) as on some road bike
> frames?
> If so what tubing sticker is on frame?
> Finally is it a second tier model with the Gipiemme group?
> ------------------------------
> Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2006 12:17:19 -0700
> From: "Bicycle Specialties" <mike@bikespecialties.com>
> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> Subject: [CR]Rearward opening rear "Drop-out".
> Message-ID: <000c01c6f3b3$33d76ed0$6401a8c0@Staff>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1"
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> Can anyone suggest a good reason why rearward opening rear "drop-outs"
> are still being used on single gear bikes?. I cannot see one good reason
> for them. Why aren't forward opening horizontal drop-outs being used?
> "Track ends" make no sense even on track bikes. It makes it more
> difficult to remove the rear wheel and when fenders are fitted wheel
> removal is a major operation. I've noticed that some makers have
> recently had rearward opening drop-outs made with fender eyelets
> incorporated, why? We have recently had customers come in with frames
> that they intend putting a fixed wheel on. Their frames have perfectly
> good long horizontal drop-outs but they ask for them to be removed and
> "track ends" fitted. What earthly improvement do they think it is going
> to make? All for style I suppose.
> Mike Barry.
> Mariposa Bicycles. Toronto.
> ------------------------------
> Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2006 19:40:30 +0000 (GMT)
> From: joebz@optonline.net
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Subject: Re: [CR][RE]outing of Lambert bicycle
> Message-ID: <e254a56c28b18.4537d4ae@optonline.net>
> In-Reply-To: <27320.>
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> The Lambert rear derailleur was a bad copy of the Suntour patented design
> except built like a poorly executed Huret Svelto. Suntour sued Lambert
> for patent infringement, as they did all slant pantograph copyists, and
> the derailleurs disappeared.
> A true story. I was looking down to try and figure out why said derailleur
> shifted so poorly when I bumped into a parked car at less than walking
> speed. The wheel was still true but the fork steerer snapped!
> Joe Bender-Zanoni
> Great Notch, NJ
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: wheelman@nac.net
> Date: Thursday, October 19, 2006 12:36 pm
> Subject: [CR][RE]outing of Lambert bicycle
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
>> Yes, Lambert did brand their own derailleurs. I have the same
>> bike and I
>> have most of the Lambert equipment on it. Also, I have had at
>> least 3
>> others of the lesser model (white and red color scheme) and they
>> had the
>> same components including branded derailleurs.
>> There are stories on the web regarding the entire history of
>> this bike
>> including the infameous death fork. I have a couple of frames
>> and forks
>> hanging out at my favorite haunt Steve Willis' (The Bike Stand).
>> I think
>> Steve said he wanted to build up one so that leaves the other for
>> sale/trade if anyone is interested. FF only, these are pretty
>> light and
>> thin tubing but are lugless versions. I believe I also have some
>> miscellaneous Lambert parts that I will also sell/trade if there
>> is any
>> interest.
>> Ray Homiski
>> Elizabeth, NJ