I'm glad that my ebay listing is entertaining as well as space-making/cash raising. Myself and Jan Heine have chatted about this one quite a bit and we are both stumped. I forgot to add in the listing that I've been intriqued about aero routing and Herse bb on a relatively heavy speedy frame. I've also pondered the idea that it was a race frame that could even do cyclocross duty - no cables under the toptube, Herse bb for dirt and wet issues, and it has canti's also. The whole thing is just a big puzzle. And the rear dropouts Norris commented on are nearly identical to those on my early 50's (I think) Daudon race/sport frame (also a heavyweight machine).
What nobody is sure of is the idea that Herse frames left the shop with more basic construction. I've seen a few frames that are attributed to Herse, with odd lugsets and basic details, but all those are of questionable build provenance as well. And the frame currently under debate is actually built wonderfully well - except for the crude dropout finishing. I have to say that neither myself or anybody I know of has really seen lesser quality frames that bear Herse lettering and solid provenance that proves it wasn't something else that was lettered as an Herse. So this all remains a mystery.
Maybe my thought that this was a cross-friendly frame and the fact that Norris saw a lesser grade Herse cross frame means something!
Any more clues will be appreciated - but hopefully it will find a good home.
Mike Kone in Boulder CO
> It's fascinating pauuzzle that Mike has set before us with his Rene
\r?\n> Herse project ...Is it a "Oui" or a "non" or pehaps a "Peut-etre"?
\r?\n>
\r?\n> Four years ago I spent a whole day...probably not long enough by far, in
\r?\n> the Bike Museum at St Etienne, that is reputed to have the finest
\r?\n> collection, in depth, of any of the several bike museums in France.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> On display were several Rene Herse bikes and frames, and a pretty good
\r?\n> biography of Herse from his origins, in the 30s ( please don't quote me
\r?\n> on this as it was 4 years ago!) as a fitter in the aero industry. The
\r?\n> biography went on to say that Herse, when in full production, employed
\r?\n> sevearl other workmen..and that not all Herse frames were made by the
\r?\n> man himself.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> I mentioned on the List a couple of years ago that one of the frames
\r?\n> attributed to the Herse workshop, and which carried Herse's name was a
\r?\n> very roughly constructed cyclo-cross frame built up with Nervex Pro
\r?\n> lugs. It really was pretty rough by any standards..and I just assumed it
\r?\n> was a frame built by an apprentice, learning his trade.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> My intent is not in any way to denigrate Herse frames, but just to point
\r?\n> out that Mike's frame could well be a Herse..but made by one of the
\r?\n> other skilled fitters/craftsmen.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> The drop-outs intrigue me because a bike turned up on French ebay last
\r?\n> week, badly photographed, but inspite of the poor quality I could make
\r?\n> out drop-outs very simmilar, possibly identical, to the ones on Mike's
\r?\n> frame.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> Thinking that they looked very much like a model very frequently used by
\r?\n> Peugeot, and assuming the frame might be a Peugeot, I decided not to bid
\r?\n> and, unfortunately I deleted the page from MY Ebay records.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> Now seeing Mike's frame I begin to wonder whether the frame might have
\r?\n> been one of a far better quality than I had thought.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> One query about this..and other Herse frames is..what is so special
\r?\n> about how Rene put the rear brake cable through the top-tube? I am
\r?\n> curious about this.
\r?\n>
\r?\n> Norris lOckley...Settle UK