[CR]Very odd Guerciotti frames ....

(Example: Framebuilding:Technology)

References: <457F62B3.5080700@aol.com>
To: cudak888@aol.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2006 00:24:50 -0500
In-Reply-To: <457F62B3.5080700@aol.com>
From: <oroboyz@aol.com>
Subject: [CR]Very odd Guerciotti frames ....

Hmmm:

Kurt, there are some troubling things here in your photos...

The paint is rough in places.. See the junk left up behind the seat stay tops and seat lugs. The gold fill in seat stay top plates is untypical.. The decals are incorrectly placed as well. IMHO, absolutely not Ten Speed Drive paint.

Then the general look of the lug shaping is off for a Guerciotti. (I know, I sold a bunch of them in-the-day)

Then, even more odd, are the CBT-Italia dropouts!

And the seat stay to rear dropout joinery is really unusual and unlike Guerciottis.. http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_10.jpg

If I were asked by a court of law, as an expert, I would GUESS that these were made up by someone else using Guerciotti bits...

Where in the world did you get these frames?

Dale Brown Greensboro, North Carolina USA

-----Original Message----- From: cudak888@aol.com To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Sent: Tue, 12 Dec 2006 9:17 PM Subject: [CR]FS: Two mint Guerciotti frames

Have two tall-frame Guerciottis for sale, as follows (please read the following notes as well):

#1: 1983 Guerciotti GL (w/Columbus SL tubing)

Frame specs: BB center to seat lug top: 64cm Top tube length: 60cm BB to top tube: 59.5cm

Pictures:

http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_1.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_2.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_3.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_4.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_5.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_6.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_7.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_8.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_9.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_10.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_11.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_12.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_13.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_14.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_15.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_16.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_17.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_62cm_18.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_7.jpg

(Ignore the fact that the image titles state "62cm")

This frame has some small, inconspicuous blemishes shown in the closeups - a small scratch in the headtube decal, a very minor one in the side of the top headlug, a few on the seatpost binder projection, few on the dropout, and some light markings around the headlug edge.

-----

#2: 1984 Guerciotti GLX (chromed frame, Columbus SLX tubing)

Frame specs: BB center to seat lug top: 63cm Top tube length: 60cm BB to top tube: 60cm

Pictures (The '84 is the taller blue frame in photos - didn't have any closeups on hand, but can provide them. The red frame is also shown in the photos. The smaller 60cm blue and red frames are NOT for sale):

http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_1.jpg (second from left) http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_2.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_3.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_4.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_5.jpg (the blue frame furthest away in photo) http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_6.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_8.jpg http://www.jaysmarine.com/guerciotti_9.jpg

This frame also has some large paint chips on the back of the seatpost binder, a few small scratches on the downtube just ahead of the shifter bosses, similar marks around the headlug as the red frame, and some tiny scrapes on the lower part of the seatstay, and an equally small one on the headtube. Can get photos of all of these marks if anyone so wishes.

-----

Neither frame have their respective forks. Both are designed for 27.2mm seatposts, and spaced for a 126mm rear hubs.

-----

Now for the bad news:

I bought these frames from a LBS who claimed these frames were NOS. Both frames certainly look so, and the inside of the tubes certainly have the NOS 'look' as well.

However, some collectors have questioned whether these machines have been repainted, as the '83 machine has the later 1984 decal set, the '84 is completely sans decals, neither frame has tubing decals present, and neither do they have the customary "Painted By Ten Speed Imports" decal found on most Guerciottis here in the States, particularly those in Florida (I'm in Miami).

I honestly must admit that I simply don't have enough experience to tell whether these are NOS, or repainted by a darn good painter, but I'm pretty much convinced at this point that they are repaints.

I leave it to you to judge - repaints or not, they are both gorgeous framesets.

----

I am asking $300/ea + shipping, OBO. Shipping would be via FedEx or UPS as buyer prefers.

If you are interested, you can email me at: cudak888@aol.com

All the best,

-Kurt K.
   _______________________________________________
   Classicrendezvous mailing list
   Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
   http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous