[CR]My 1980? Colnago on Ebay, item 330010297735

(Example: Racing:Jacques Boyer)

Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 20:31:15 -0700 (PDT)
From: "brian" <bbspokes@yahoo.com>
To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
In-Reply-To: <MONKEYFOODiGuOdN66k000006ae@monkeyfood.nt.phred.org>
Subject: [CR]My 1980? Colnago on Ebay, item 330010297735

Since we are on the subject I thought I would mention I am selling a 1980 Colnago on Ebay finishing Friday morning. Can the experts tell me if this is actually a 79? Purchase date is early 1981 but the bike looks much more like the 70's bikes than the 80's with their sloped crowns and prefabricated stay ends. Also the 81 bikes usually have Colnago stamped on the side of the drive side chainstay. I am bracing for the comments. Ebay item 330010297735. Notice the stay and fork ends are nicely hand scalloped insted of inserted into prefabbed taped ends. I also have other items mostly CR relavant, my ID is bbspokes. I am facing the reality that I may have to move in the next year or two so I must sell some precious items, so I expect to sell another half dozen bikes to fit in my next apartment. Brian Blum in Berkeley

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CR

Today's Topics:

1. re: ebay outing German Colnago 2. Confente on E-Bay 3. Confente 62 cm (Bianca Pratorius) 4. Re: Mid-70s Colnago, my ex-one (Raymond Dobbins) 5. Woman's Crescent Pepita special? (veterinary technician) 6. Re: Confente on E-Bay (Chuck Schmidt) 7. Colnago Sport (Perry Lopez) 8. Re: Confente on E-Bay 9. Re: Colnago Sport 10. Re: Confente on E-Bay (Mike Schmidt) 11. Eisentraut ebay outing/frame repair question (Leonard Diamond) 12. Re: Is it really a 60s Team Mercier? Now 70s Mercier Catalog Spec's 13. Colnago on CR (mike) 14. RE: Colnago on CR (David Toppin) 15. Re: Old 'nago talk (Dale B. Phelps)

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 17:09:50 -0700 (GMT-07:00) From: chasds@mindspring.com To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]re: ebay outing German Colnago Message-ID: <26429013.1153958991140.JavaMail.root@mswamui-cedar.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Reply-To: chasds@mindspring.com Message: 1

Lou Deeter outed this Colnago:

http://ebay.com/<blah> Z56197QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

# 220009133567

Now this is a kinda cool frame. I'm fascinated by the graphics on it.

The finish details date the frame at about 1974, but the graphics look like 1978, or later. The head-tube graphic is a very sweet blend of the early 70s badge and the later 70s badge. I can't say I've ever seen one that looks like it. It's a first in my experience.

I'd love to know if that's really original paint. It looks like it.

All of which goes to prove the truth of something one of our Netherlands members said a couple of years ago: colnagos came every which way, and it's very tricky dating them based purely on the graphics, or even frame details. Although the shape of the lugs, the size, shape, and quantity of the lug cut-outs, the shape of the seat-stay cap flutes, are fairly good guides.

If that Colnago in German was my size, I'd be tempted. Cool piece.

As for the supposed evaluation of that other colnago discussed earlier... if that guy can get a nice Carbon frame for it, he should go for it, imho.

Where people get this stuff is beyond me. He talked to Ernesto's SON? I wouldn't mind hearing more about that.

Charles "sceptic" Andrews SoCal ------------------------------

Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 20:15:22 -0400 From: To: Subject: [CR]Confente on E-Bay Message-ID: <20060727001522.TPVG17714.ibm68aec.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 2

The only other item this seller has sold on Ebay was a Louis Vitton trunk and it had some really nice photos. It seems strange that he would not provide photos of the Confente bike, being such a rarity. The drawings he did post are really crummy also. I wonder how many folks with the cash are gullible enough to wire the cash to his bank without actually seeing the bike. We only have his word that it's a real Confente. Has anyone ever been to DC and bought one of those "Bolex" watches? This would be a real scream if the bike was in Nigeria. Fred Durrette Summerville, SC

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 20:22:39 -0400 From: Bianca Pratorius To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]Confente 62 cm Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v623) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 3

Let's see... the seller on ebay refuses to post photos... he has 1 total feedback... and refuses to ship. He is, however, nice enough to post a pencil drawing of the headtube. The only hypothetically, worse seller would be one who would refuse to describe the bike, and had no previous sales. In other words, this guy is the penultimate worst possible seller. Unless you're the kind of person who is game to stick your tongue out at a charging rhinoceros, I would pass on this one.

Garth Libre in Miami Fl.

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 17:31:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Raymond Dobbins To: LouDeeter@aol.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]Mid-70s Colnago, my ex-one Message-ID: <20060727003127.61155.qmail@web60425.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <590.153fd8d.31f954d9@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: list Message: 4

I had one of these. I bought it as a 72, but many here on the list believed it was a 74, or 73 at the earliest, so I describe on my website as a 73. It has the drilling and milling that was characteristic of that age for Colnago. For those who haven't seen it, here's the link to the photo album:

http://www.raydobbins.com/supernew/index.html

I wish I still had it, but there's this 10 bike limit thing I had to deal with.

Ray Dobbins Miami, Florida

LouDeeter@aol.com wrote:

Charles Andrews said, about the Colnago on Craig's list:

Colnagos of this vintage are increasingly hard to find though--in any condition at all--so if you could get it for cheap, it would make a nice rider, if dolled-up a little.

_http://ebay.com/<blah> itemZ220009133567QQihZ012QQcategoryZ56197QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem _ (http://ebay.com/<blah> em)

See link above. This seller offers a 1974 Colnago, a Gilco tubed Colnago and a pantographed Grandis. Despite the higher shipping from Germany, they are still decently priced at the time of my writing this. As Charles pointed out, early 70s Colnagos are increasingly hard to find. Lou Deeter, Orlando FL

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Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 00:30:28 +0000 From: "veterinary technician" To: Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]Woman's Crescent Pepita special? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 5

Hi folks, man am I happy... I just picked up a great Women's bike for my gal and am wondering about this old Crescent. I know the Mens Pepita was considered a decent Swedish bike but have never ever seen anything about a womans model.... This one is exactly like the orange 1970 Mens shown on Classic R. (except for the lack of a top tube) and so I'm wondering if this was meant to be a woman's road bike , comfort bike, or something else?? Does anybody know what the deal is w/ this one? My girlfriend is going to flip after I clean it and surprise her w/ it... she no longer has an excuse to steal my Raleigh 5 speed for Sat morning coffee! Thanks, Mark S. Denver,CO USA

_________________________________________________________________ Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 17:31:51 -0700 From: Chuck Schmidt To: CLASSIC RENDEZVOUS Subject: Re: [CR]Confente on E-Bay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20060727001522.TPVG17714.ibm68aec.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net> References: <20060727001522.TPVG17714.ibm68aec.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 6

This whole thread is starting to make me laugh! I see no "RED FLAGS" with this auction whatsoever.

The seller states: "...local pickup only (no shipping)." and "Cash only (no cashier checks) will be accepted on buyers approval of item. Wire money directly to my bank."

If I was selling my Confente (two numbers before the frame being auctioned) I'd have the buyer (or his representative) look over the frame and then, upon their approval of the frame, give me the CASH. There's no way I'd pack up a frame worth $4500 plus and send it off with a shipper... no way. And yes, if a complete Confente went for $8,000 on eBay more than a few years ago (a CR member was the buyer), then the frame might actually be worth $4500... if you want to own a Confente that is.

Time for the list to take their chill pill.

Chuck Schmidt South Pasadena, Southern California

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 17:41:42 -0700 From: Perry Lopez

To: Subject: [CR]Colnago Sport Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain;charset="US-ASCII" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 7

Would anyone like to comment on this??

http://ebay.com/<blah> QitemZ320011132286QQihZ011QQcategoryZ98084QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Zerran Sierra Madre, CA

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 20:47:29 EDT From: LouDeeter@aol.com To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]Confente on E-Bay Message-ID: <4d3.47932eb.31f96721@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 8

In a message dated 7/26/2006 8:32:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, chuckschmidt@earthlink.net writes:

There's no way I'd pack up a frame worth $4500 plus and send it off with a shipper... no way. And yes, if a complete Confente went for $8,000 on eBay more than a few years ago (a CR member was the buyer), then the frame might actually be worth $4500... if you want to own a Confente that is.

Wayne Bingham posted a Craigslist offering earlier today from 7-25-06 which said the seller had offered it locally in SoCal for almost $15000. The $4500 is only an opening bid, without meeting reserve. Also, the provenance should be easy to check--doesn't Jim Cunningham have all the original owners listed by serial number? I agree with Chuck regarding shipping, whether it be $4500 or $15000. I wouldn't ship a rare bike like this either, particularly since I could probably find a buyer in the SoCal area. But, you would think that he would have shown at least one picture. I'd like to have # 69 though. Lou Deeter, Orlando FL

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 20:57:45 EDT From: LouDeeter@aol.com To: Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]Colnago Sport Message-ID: <4a0.2f14b1b.31f96989@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 9

Zerran of the California Mountains says:

Would anyone like to comment on this??

http://ebay.com/<blah> QitemZ320011132286QQihZ011QQcategoryZ98084QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I'll comment. It's a cheap Colnago, built to capitalize on the name, simple as that. I saw a lot of similar Colnago bikes in Germany in the mid-80s. They were offered new for about half what the higher end Colnagos were. I didn't know a lot about the higher end market at the time, but I was always impressed when one of the soldiers showed me the Colnago he bought with Campagnolo parts for less than $500. I once had a Colnago come thru my hands that had English threading and the Colnago letters stamped into the chainstays. I recall someone told me it was made in Taiwan &/or was a counterfeit. Folks have been hitting it on the head today--you never know what you'll get with some of these Colnagos. Lou Deeter, Orlando FL

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 21:13:02 -0400 From: "Mike Schmidt" To: "Chuck Schmidt" , "CLASSIC RENDEZVOUS" Subject: Re: [CR]Confente on E-Bay Message-ID: <00cc01c6b119$cee5c020$86fc9518@vaio> References: <20060727001522.TPVG17714.ibm68aec.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net>

Content-Type: text/plain;charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 10

Yo Chuck,

The dude is a rude. I can corroborate Tom Sander's story of the seller's bedside manner. If you are going to sell a rare bike, a seller should be able to show photos, not illustrations, that represent its condition. So far, he illustrates his arrogance better than the bike.

A brown Confente? Barf! Retch!, no wonder he does not want to show photos.

Mike Schmidt reporting live on a balmy July evening from.. South Stirling, Southern part of Northern NJ


----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Schmidt"
To: "CLASSIC RENDEZVOUS"
Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2006 8:31 PM
Subject: Re: [CR]Confente on E-Bay



> This whole thread is starting to make me laugh! I see no "RED FLAGS"
> with this auction whatsoever.
>
> The seller states:
> "...local pickup only (no shipping)." and "Cash only (no cashier
> checks) will be accepted on buyers approval of item. Wire money
> directly to my bank."
>
> If I was selling my Confente (two numbers before the frame being
> auctioned) I'd have the buyer (or his representative) look over the
> frame and then, upon their approval of the frame, give me the CASH.
> There's no way I'd pack up a frame worth $4500 plus and send it off
> with a shipper... no way. And yes, if a complete Confente went for
> $8,000 on eBay more than a few years ago (a CR member was the buyer),
> then the frame might actually be worth $4500... if you want to own a
> Confente that is.
>
> Time for the list to take their chill pill.
>
> Chuck Schmidt
> South Pasadena, Southern California
>
> .
> _______________________________________________

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 21:44:39 -0400 From: "Leonard Diamond" To: "'CR Rendezvous'" Subject: [CR]Eisentraut ebay outing/frame repair question Message-ID: <003901c6b11e$3d87e810$2f01a8c0@Office1> In-Reply-To: <44C7AAE6.3040902@hahaha.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 11

While perusing ebay I came across this frame, being sold as a 1974 Eisentraut: http://ebay.com/<blah> d=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Item # 300010402172

Although it is in lousy shape and I wasn't even sure it was an Eisentraut I was intrigued because I have spent many hours and miles following a friend on his (which he did 2 PBP's on). I emailed Albert Eisentraut to see if it was one of his frames and to ask if he would repair it. I hope I'm not being rude by posting his response but it seems benign enough.

"Based on the photos it looks like a frame I made, a Limited. I would say that it is not worth fixing and I would not do it. Usually when an old frames cracks one place it is ready to crack another. It is very strainge for both chainstay to crack.

Albert Eisentraut"

It's hard to argue with the dean of American framebuilders and I'm sure that from a monetary standpoint the frame is a loser but he seems to feel that it isn't worth repairing old frames with a cracked tube. Is that a common view? Len Diamond Ridgewood, NJ

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Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 21:49:55 EDT From: IKersey@aol.com To: Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org, nickzz@mindspring.com Subject: Re: [CR]Is it really a 60s Team Mercier? Now 70s Mercier Catalog Spec's Message-ID: <321.88dbc55.31f975c3@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 12

The following spec's are extracted from an early to mid 70s Mercier catalog from Beacon Cycle and Supply Co.:

Model 300: Reynolds 531 double butted frame, front and rear forks. Chromium plated front fork ends. Simplex Criterium front and rear gear changers. Simplex frame mount shift controls. Normandy Competition Dural QR large flange hubs Stronglight headset. Stronglight professional crank set and chainwheel 46 x 52 (picture looks like a Stronglight 93). Simplex cable clips. Dural pedals with reflectors. Chrome seat post. MAFAC brakes with hooded levers and adjusters. Atom 66 competition freewheel 14 x 24. Sedis chain. Mavic Monthlery alloy rims. Chromed straight gauge spokes. Hutchinson tubular sew-up racing tires. Ideale 2000 molded saddle. Dural handlebar. Dural AMC handlebar stem. Tornade Dural ringed pump with AFA express connector. Brazed-on pump clips. Toe clips and straps. Approximate Weight: 22 lbs. Colors: Orange, Red, Sky Blue, White, Yellow, Kelly Green, and Purple Frame Sizes: 19 1/2", 21", 23", 25"

Model 200: Luxtub tubing - frame, front and rear forks. Chromium plated front fork ends. Simplex Prestige front and rear gear changers and frame mount shift controls. Normandy Dural QR large flange hubs Precision fork ends. 3 pin steel chainwheel 46 x 52. Brazed-on cable clips. Steel rattrap pedals with reflectors. MAFAC brakes with hooded levers and adjusters. Normandy freewheel 14 x 24. Sedis chain. Mavic Sport alloy rims. Butted rustless spokes. Hutchinson sew-up tubular racing tires. Molded vinyl covered saddle. Dural handlebar stem. Dural handlebar. Tornade Dural ringed pump with AFA express connector. Brazed-on pump clips. Toe clips and straps. Cloth handlebar tape. Special hand striping. Approximate Weight: 25 lbs. Colors: Orange, Red, Sky Blue, White, Yellow, Kelly Green, and Purple Frame Sizes: 19 1/2", 21", 23", 25"

Model 100 (and 111 Mixte): Luxtub tubing - frame, front and rear forks. Chromium plated front fork ends. Simplex front and rear gear changers. Simplex frame mounted shift controls. Normandy Dural QR large flange hubs 3 pin steel chainwheel 40 x 52. Brazed-on cable clips. Rattrap steel pedals with reflectors. MAFAC brakes with hooded levers and adjusters. Normandy freewheel 14 x 28. Sedis chain. Rigida steel rims, serrated edges. Butted rustless spokes. Hutchinson high pressure gumwall tires. Molded vinyl saddle. Steel handlebar. Dural handlebar stem. Tornade Dural ringed pump. Brazed-on pump clips. Black handlebar tape. Special hand striping. Approximate Weight: 25 lbs. Colors: Orange, Red, Sky Blue, White, Yellow, Kelly Green, and Purple. Frame Sizes: 19 1/2", 21", 23", 25" (20" and 22" for mixte)

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