Hi Jim, what you are facing is the difference between the Japanese Industrial standard taper (on the cranks) and the ISO taper (European). What this means is that the crank will not sit on the taper fully as it is bigger (some 2mm) and consequently the cranks sit up to 5mm out. Of course nowadays the big 2 not only have different tapers but widths as well! For further info see Sheldon "the Oracle" Browns listing on bottom brackets. Regards Yan from South Wales (UK)
-----Original Message----- From: classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org [mailto:classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org] On Behalf Of classicrendezvous-request@bikelist.org Sent: 26 April 2007 19:58 To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 52, Issue 105
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Today's Topics:
1. Suntour Superbe Pro crankset taper (AdventureCORPS News) 2. re: gios coins 3. Re: new ebay scam - successful (bruce thomson) 4. For sale.........Various (Sadiq Gill) 5. WTB 27", 32 hole rim (John Barry) 6. newbie question - fork blades (Emanuel Lowi) 7. Re:Dating Carlton (Donald Gillies) 8. Re: on eBay: Gios fork crown "coin" (Donald Gillies) 9. Re: Dating Carlton (Pete Geurds) 10. Pre-war Gloria (Art Link) 11. FS: Fuso, Tesch, Davidson, Sachs (Taz Taylor) 12. Re: Carlton (Hilary Stone) 13. on ebay-Gios Fork Crown "Coin" (Peter Weigle) 14. re:Specialized - now who made what? (KO Kevin)
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Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 09:42:20 -0700 From: AdventureCORPS News <news@adventurecorps.com> To: jimbobadahey@hotmail.com, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]Suntour Superbe Pro crankset taper Message-ID: <5499B278-CB61-46BA-B848-2596343748D9@adventurecorps.com> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=US-ASCII;delsp=yes;format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 1
Hi Jim
I'm no Suntour expert and perhaps they changed their taper with different iterations of their cranks over the years, but that said, I have a later model Superbe Pro crank and it definitely does not work with Campy from that period. It requires a special, Suntour-specific taper. In my case, I ordered a "custom" Phil Wood BB in that taper through Rivendell. The other alternative is tracking down a matching Suntour BB. If you jam it onto a Campy BB, it will not go on far enough and the crank will sit outboard quite a bit. This "works," but I would guess is prone to coming loose and perhaps dangerous. That, and it's not comfortable since the crank arm is shoved outboard so much.
Best,
Chris Kostman
-- AdventureCORPS, Inc. 638 Lindero Canyon Rd #311 Oak Park, CA 91377 USA http://www.adventurecorps.com http://www.badwater.com http://www.the508.com
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Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 16:27:47 +0000 From: "james young" <jimbobadahey@hotmail.com> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]Suntour Superbe Pro crankset taper Message-ID: <BAY102-F1127F1FCFB0BE6CDE3579DE480@phx.gbl> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 16
Hi all,
I've just purchased a Suntour Superbe Pro chainset on ebay, and the listing stated that it uses the ISO/Campy taper - does anyone know if this is correct?
Regards,
Jim Young Edinburgh, Scotland.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 09:40:47 -0700 (GMT-07:00)
From: chasds@mindspring.com
To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Subject: [CR]re: gios coins
Message-ID:
<23581945.1177605647699.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net
>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Precedence: list
Reply-To: chasds@mindspring.com
Message: 2
Mike Kone wrote:
Perhaps the "coin collectors" of Gios know better, but doesn't Excel Sports in Boulder have these for sale on a regular basis?
And are the Excel ones MS-65 or perhaps available in a Proof version? And are there outside companies that can certify and seal your Gios coins?
Mike "coin collector talking" Kone in Boulder CO
*******
for what it's worth, I bought a pair of those coins a couple of months ago. I was told at that time that these were the last ones Excel had, and that they were not sure if Gios was still making them. Be worth calling them if you need a set, to find out, though.
Charles Andrews Los Angeles ------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 10:01:03 -0700 (PDT) From: bruce thomson <masi3v4me@yahoo.com> To: Donald Gillies <gillies@cs.ubc.ca>, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR] new ebay scam - successful Message-ID: <810526.96501.qm@web51607.mail.re2.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <200704251939.l3PJduIN023062@cascade.cs.ubc.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: list Reply-To: rapidfire10ring@hotmail.com Message: 3
Listers: This is a new avenue of the internet criminal. I am suggesting that it has elevated one step further than Don has reported. I was the perusing the auctions as I have been know to do when my eyes fell on an item of interest. When I clicked on the item a dialog "log-in" box appeared. I was not able to view the particulars of the auction because I could not navigate the page without "filling out" the dialog box. Now when I back-clicked I was returned to my search. Again when I clicked on the auction the dialog "log-in" box appeared again. Now that is really sinister. BT
Donald Gillies <gillies@cs.ubc.ca> wrote: I got a message from an ebay seller concerning an item that I had bid upon. I had even been messaging that seller so a message from him was not unexpected. Out of hundreds of ebay messages, this one really fooled me because they leveraged a transaction that I was actually involved in.
When I attempted to respond, i got a login page to respond to the message, and the scammer picked off my ebay password. I realized the scam about 10 secs later and changed my password before any harm was done.
This is probably why bidder's addresses are now kept secret on auction pages.
- Don Gillies San Diego, CA _______________________________________________
Bruce Thomson Spokane WA 99204 (509) 747 4314 Masi3v4me@yahoo.com
--------------------------------- Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 13:03:29 -0400 From: "Sadiq Gill" <sadiqgill@gmail.com> To: "CR RENDEZVOUS" <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Subject: [CR]For sale.........Various Message-ID: <c76dc510704261003w44183ff1g32849309283ab19@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 4
-Early Shimano Dura Ace nutted brake calipers--good cond. Originally black but now grey due to fading, good shape all hardware included------ feel strong--$45
-Mavic GEL 280 rims......used but in perfect shape, 28 holes, blue label--- -$40 for pair plus shipping
-Super Record 53 T chainring VGC--$28
-Cinelli Oval Milano French Stem 22.0 80mm extension 26.4 bar clamp VGC--$4 0
-Shimano 130mm bcd 46T early Dura Ace ring stamped S in a circle VGC--$28
-KOF Bars: Ritchey WCS Classic Bend Bars both installed but never ridden, one has the newer more colorful logo
$42 (each) plus $10 shipping in the CONUS
-FIAMME ERGAL rims:36 holes used but in fine shape $40 for the pair plus shipping
-- Sadiq Gill Richmond, VA
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Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 10:08:46 -0700 (PDT) From: John Barry <usazorro@yahoo.com> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]WTB 27", 32 hole rim Message-ID: <266857.88951.qm@web50209.mail.re2.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <36114.47051.qm@web33503.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: list Message: 5
Good day all,
I have a harebrained idea for a non-urgent project. In order to complete it, I need to lay hands on a 27" rim with 32 holes that would comfortably seat a 1-1/4" tire. I would much prefer alloy to steel, and also would much prefer something that's used, but in respectable shape.
If you have such a rim that you're willing to part with, please send me details for consideration (off-list please).
Thanks,
John (getting psyched for Cirque) Barry Mechanicsburg, PA, USA
__________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 13:23:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Emanuel Lowi <lowiemanuel@yahoo.ca> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]newbie question - fork blades Message-ID: <417169.86419.qm@web50503.mail.re2.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <MONKEYFOODcL4hsT9JM00000fb2@monkeyfood.nt.phred.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: list Message: 6
Why do track bikes traditionally have round section fork blades while road forks are oval?
Is there any reason NOT to use round blades on a road bike?
Emanuel Lowi Montreal, Quebec
Be smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk
email the boot with the All-new Yahoo! Mail at
http://mrd.mail.yahoo.com/
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Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 10:31:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Donald Gillies <gillies@cs.ubc.ca> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Cc: beejax@cox.net Subject: Re:[CR]Dating Carlton Message-ID: <200704261731.l3QHV41e021339@cascade.cs.ubc.ca> Precedence: list Message: 7
There are a few things to know about Carlton dating. First, Carltons generally used stamped dropouts throughout the 1950's, so that can give you a hint as to the age of the bicycle.
Second, there are two sources of serial numbers and years on the web :
http://www.carltoncycles.me.uk - carlton enthusiast veteran's cycle club http://www.retroraleighs.com - carlton owned by raleigh 1960 and beyond.
I think the date series in http://www.retroraleighs.com is more reliable than in http://www.carltoncycles.me.uk - because in certain cases retroraleighs is sustained by paper documentation directly from raleigh / carlton itself.
So, for a stamped-dropout bike, checkout carltoncycles.me.uk, and for a forged dropout bike, check out retroraleighs.com.
Second, if you have ANY logo or lug or braze-on information for the bike, tell us because Carlton normally changed SOMETHING on every MODEL in EVERY year. For example, I can identify most 1970's raleigh-carltons to with +/- 1 year even nude with NO paint.
- Don Gillies San Diego, CA ------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 10:38:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Donald Gillies <gillies@cs.ubc.ca> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR] on eBay: Gios fork crown "coin" Message-ID: <200704261738.l3QHc27r021770@cascade.cs.ubc.ca> Precedence: list Message: 8
One funny thing is, I believe that the your coin grading scale (MS-65) DID NOT EXIST when the gios coins were first issued !!
Secondly, wouldn't GIOS coins be just about the easiest bikepart on earth to reproduce? I mean, just take a wax casting of it, then you need some sort of plastic (like lucite acrylic) that can be molded at room temperature. Imagine a clear coin with gold underneath, that would look waycool !!! Or, just spray paint it gold once it's dry.
- Don "Coin before Bike Collector" Gillies San Diego, CA ------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 13:56:11 -0400 From: "Pete Geurds" <raleighpro@dejazzd.com> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Subject: Re: [CR]Dating Carlton Message-ID: <0c7201c7882c$2cd084b0$6401a8c0@peter5x12klm15> References: <3DA1F531-5A01-495A-9303-95F6555D2392@cox.net> Content-Type: text/plain;format=flowed;charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 9
From: "Brian & Vicki Jackson" <beejax@cox.net> To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2007 10:27 AM Subject: [CR]Dating Carlton
> Hi all,
> I'm looking to date a Carlton #C17672.
> If anyone knows where the info might be available please contact me
off
> list.
> Kind Regards
> Brian Jackson
> Lakeside ,USA
Sorry I can't help. But let me request we do this on list so I and others can learn something besides Masi history! ; )
Pete Geurds Douglassville, Pa. USA
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 11:16:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Art Link <artlink@columnssanantonio.com> To: classic rendezvous <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Subject: [CR]Pre-war Gloria Message-ID: <20070426181635.18030.qmail@web51601.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Precedence: list Reply-To: artlink@columnssanantonio.com Message: 10
Did anyone on the List snag the Gloria frame off of e-bay a few days ago,or did it go off to Europe? A great rare,thoroughbred frame. I bid beyond my limit but was sniped at the end. Art Link,San Antonio,TX,USA
The Columns on Alamo Welcome to our bed and breakfast in San Antonio, Texas. Come fiesta with us! We offer off-street parking, and the downtown trolley stops just a 1/2 block away! All rooms have a private bath, TV and telephone. Wireless Internet Access available in all rooms (EXCEPT the Rockhouse Cottage) Please contact us if you have any questions, thanks! (210)271-3245 * (800)233-3364 * ArtLink@ColumnsSanAntonio.com
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Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 14:36:30 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: Taz Taylor <taztaylor@mindspring.com> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]FS: Fuso, Tesch, Davidson, Sachs Message-ID: <15692240.1177612590790.JavaMail.root@mswamui-backed.atl.sa.earthlink.ne t> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Reply-To: Taz Taylor <taztaylor@mindspring.com> Message: 11
Hi all,
Due to some unexpected expenses, I'm offering for sale a few frames and a bike.
Delivery to Cirque is available - actually encouraged. I can ship also, but will be either tomorrow or after May 15th. Please email with any interest or questions.
Frames:
Dave Moulton Fuso, 56cm, Red/yellow fade with Campy headset and BB. $425.00 (Very nice, but 2 other Moultons make this one expendable.)
Davidson Impulse, 53cm, White with blue seattube, headtube, fork, Shimano 600 headset. $325.00
Richard Sachs, 56cm, early 80s or possibly late 70's. Has over bottom bracket cable routing brazeons. Medium length lug points (compared to my 87 Sachs) with cutouts. Repaint, red with no decals. I haven't pulled fork yet to check serial number. Spaced to 130. Very nice frame. $1100.00 If no immediate interest, this may be going Joe Bell for a repaint and decals, so think quickly.
Bike:
Dave Tesch Hwy 101 - 54cm complete bike, blue/metallic white fade. Built with off topic Campy ergo 8spd, except super record crank. $1100. this bike was displayed at '05 Cirque.
All are in very good condition. There are some nicks/scratches to slight degree, but no rust or 'patina' and definitely no 'issues' like dents or ripples.
I'm probably leaving something out, so email any questions or comments. I can provide photos on request. I will be out of town and most likely no email access from May 2nd-May 15th so I will follow up to any responses when I return.
Thanks, Taz
Taz Taylor Atlanta, GA taztaylor@mindspring.com
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Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 19:41:02 +0100 From: Hilary Stone <hilary.stone@blueyonder.co.uk> To: Brian & Vicki Jackson <beejax@cox.net>, Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR]Re: Carlton Message-ID: <4630F23E.8090105@blueyonder.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <42CB6B22-BA80-4271-AA96-2B513D61116D@cox.net> References: <42CB6B22-BA80-4271-AA96-2B513D61116D@cox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 12
It is a Mass Start Special - the Mass Start is altogether a plainer lugged frame - the C series of numbers in this case lasted from c1948-52. The model itself is in an early 1951 catalogue. It only lasted
for a couple of years. In the 1953 catalogue the lugwork is also
described as being used on the scroll pattern Flyer model. I am not
perfectly sure of the year it was introduced for my next earlier
catalogue I think dates from c1948. But with a relatively high number
with the C prefix I suspect your frame dates from 1951 to 1952. It is
illustrated in the Carlton catalogue included in the Lightweight Cycle
Catalogues volume reprinted by the V-CC in England. There are some
details regarding Carlton frame numbers and pictures of the lugs from
the V-CC marque enthusiast for Carltons at
http://www.carltoncycles.me.uk/
regards
Hilary Stone, Bristol, England
Brian & Vicki Jackson wrote:
>
> Hi Hilary,
> Got this from Paul Cameron about a year ago, he thought it was a Mass
> Start from around 1952. Looks to have never been built up, although it
> does have braze ons for the down tube shifters. I built it up with
parts
> I had around so I could ride it.
> Thanks for any info you can offer
>
> Brian Jackson
> Please visit us at http://www.jacksonwoodworks.com
> Turned wood art and more!
>
>
>
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>
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Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 14:53:50 -0400 From: "Peter Weigle" <jpweigle@sbcglobal.net> To: "Classicrendezvous@Bikelist.Org" <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Subject: [CR]on ebay-Gios Fork Crown "Coin" Message-ID: <000301c78834$3a8c7930$210110ac@PETERTR0JQH071> Content-Type: text/plain;format=flowed;charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 13
I have 2 different sets of Gios/"Italian nickles"in my colection, The earlier version of the coin was made of metal, the later ones plastic.
The plastic ones were always hard to remove at repaint time, but I learned a trick way to remove them. I would take my air hose w/ a rubber tipped blow gun attached and press it against the vent hole in the fork blade, squeeze the button and it would
usually remove it. While doing this I would hold my thumb over the coin so I wouldn't loose it, and this also prevented the coin from breaking in half if part of it was stuck, and part was loose... Maybe this will help one of you someday at repaint time. Peter Weigle Lyme, Ct.
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Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 11:55:15 -0700 From: "KO Kevin" <kko@ci.springfield.or.us> To: "Classic Rendezvous" <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Subject: [CR]re:Specialized - now who made what? Message-ID: <4E5ACC97F0E9F44AA1AE70E250AE5B817A9CDF@spifs005.Springfield1.net> Content-Type: text/plain;charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 14
I seem to recall that the Specialized Cranksets were made by Ofmega, and were very similar to their Mistral model. Many years ago when I owned a bike shop here in Eugene, I "converted" three Specialized road sets to use on a tandem, installing heli-coils to correct the pedal threading.
Kevin Ko Eugene, OR
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End of Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 52, Issue 105 **************************************************