Re: [CR]How much pedigree do you need to be historical ?

(Example: Production Builders:Teledyne)

Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 13:00:22 +0200 (CEST)
From: "nick Bordo" <nicbordeaux@yahoo.fr>
Subject: Re: [CR]How much pedigree do you need to be historical ?
To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org


Hello all, thanks for the mail on and off list. Fred has a good point, even though I can't agree with "low professional". You have or had (I have no interest in modern racing) over here local championships, minor division stuff with some semi-pros. Then you got really serious with Championnat Départemental, which is your equivalent Stateside of State Championships (you have those ?). Then Regional championships, which is several "states" top racers and champions racing. Next rung up, Championnat de France. After that, you have only the worldchampionships.

It is true that at Championnat départemental level you had the boys on the way up, and the guys on the way out, pro riders who hadn't found a ride or were getting a little to old.

So we are looking at a up and coming pro racer's machine, racing at two divisions down from wordchamp. The boy who raced this one finished top three in a major French Tour (not TDF), took part in wordchampionships with the National Team etc and is now a influential figure in cycling. The thing is I have the bike right next to me, so I can judge the level of quality, whereas all the poor CR members have only my lousy writing and poor digital pics. Obviously, as I pointed out, the bike is the one he rode to Champion d'Aquitaine just before he turned "heavyweight" Pro, so my point still remains valid: does the bike have to be the one ridden in a particularly famous race, or does it having been the one raced to high level championship whilst on the way up confer any historic value to it. A bit like does Schumachers F1 get to be the only collectable, or does his other machinery warrant collecting ?

My real interest in this bike is that is amongst the last of the true steelies. The reason the gear is not all original is that the person who bought it years ago got it as a frameset with, he claims, bars, levers and chainset.

Stephan Andranian may be right about it being a Gitane, I only have trouble with it having no serial number or visible markings. It wouldn't be a 87 model, because by this time, the racer was high level pro.

Otherwise, I had a kind mail from a person from some small town in Massachusetts saying that I should be saying historic, not historical, and I will go with that. He further pointed out that the bike had about as much interest as a bike been ridden by the Mayor of Bordeaux. I'm not on close terms with that particular Mayor, so he could be right and Mayors of Bordeaux get to ride historic racing machines. It is an interesting track I shall have to pursue.

In the meantime I shall be using google earth to try and locate Boston, I guess it must be some small hick town I never got to hear about at school. Mea Culpa and all that if I'm wrong.

Best

Nick "M" Bordo, Landes 40, France

Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 17:28:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Fred Rednor <fred_rednor@yahoo.com> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: Re: [CR]How much pedigree do you need to be historical ?

Nice bike - even with the mix of parts - or perhaps because of that mixture... Anyway, if someone was low level professional, and the local shop gives him the discount "professionnel" (or he won a front derailleur as a prime), wouldn't he simply smile, take the piece, and use it when his old pieces wore out? In the past, this might even have been true for a guy like Marc Gomez?

By the way, your Bakelite lantern is "tres cool", so treat it with some respect.
     Fred Rednor - Arlington, Virginia (USA)


--- nick Bordo wrote:


> Seeing as I got no response to my post on a bakelite light
> yesterday, I went out this morning in a huff and purchased a
> racing bike with pedigree. Not a TDF winner. A winner of the
> Championnat d'Aquitaine, arguably the most competitive
> regional championship in France. The guy who rode it all
> season to final victory went from semi-pro to pro after that.
> He was part of the French Team at world championships. And
> other things that count.
>
> Pictures and a little comment on this bike at
> http://membres.lycos.fr/partspeekers then you got to look
> for the bottom left link called "historical or hyterical" or
> something to that effect. You can be your own judge as to
> whether this particular bike could be deemed "of real
> historical interest". The point being how far up the racing
> ladder does a bike have to go, or it's owner to later reach
> for it to be more valuable than a similar bike with no racing
> pedigree. Hope I get some coments on and off list on this one
> :)
>
> As a machine, I normally wouldn't have bought it. Not my
> taste in bikes. But it has history. I reckon it has enough
> history to make it worth more than the sum of it's parts.

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