To Mr Peter Naiman: What belongs on the list or not is mainly, I'd say, the concern of the listmaster Dale Brown. Regarding badge lifting, we are not talking left over badges from unknown sources (old parts boxes bought in, etc), we are not talking prising them off wrecked bikes which have been under a prelimlinary crushing at a scrapyard and are totally irrecoverable (or wrecked in any other fashion), we are not talking about people who have been collecting badges for years, sourced at a time when a load of bikes, thick on the ground, were not collectable... No, we are talking about quick buck criminals who spend their time lifting badges off any and all bikes, who don't like bikes in any manner, and are just a bunch of pilfering criminals indulging in vandalism (one may care to look at the definition of vandal in a dictionnary, or Google if one has no dictionnary) , out for a quick buck. These are the guys who will as a friend put it to me sell you a NOS item in two parts: the item one listing, the box in another. Or split a derailleur in two: sell the cage in one listing, the body in another. We are talking guys whose knowlege of bikes is "that one's bage is worth "x" to some dumb collector, gimme a screwdriver quick".
Therefore, there comes a time when any self-respecting collector and/or bike lover stands up and says "NO more of this", or at the very least "I'm having no part in this".
There are loose bages of reputable provenance on the market. I have personally pointed my accusing finger at nobody in particular. But when I check out a badge sellers' listings and past bidding and see it's all on badges, I blacklist that guy: he does not see my money, however badly I need the badge or whatever he's selling. He can sit on it. I agree totally with Ted Ernst on this one: robbing a bike of it's identity for a quick buck is aggravated rape.
Preaching ? Come off it boys, since when has stating the obvious been preaching? Please...
Nick March, Mont de Marsan, France (where we don't need soap boxes to say what we think)
"...On the same note, I may assume that the vast majority of members on this list buy parts, badges etc, to rebuild their newly acquired classic. So I think it a bit strange when list members are on a "Soap Box" preaching to the choir about not wanting to buy a head badge on Ebay, or bashing the seller of a badge. We do not know where the parts or badge came from, but most likely from a classic that was stripped. Unless we are an extreme purist who only buys fully unrestored complete Vintage bicycles, we are all part of the feeding chain.
I do agree with a fellow list member who wrote earlier today. Casting aspersions on unknown sellers is in poor taste, whether calling them nerds from France or Hippies on Fixed Gears. Such brow beating and name calling doesn't belong on this list.
Just my long winded point of view. I'll now get down off of my soap box.
Regards, Peter Naiman Glendale, WI"
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