Re: [CR] Were Campy brakes so superior?

(Example: Production Builders:Peugeot)

Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 12:26:19 -0800 (PST)
From: "Kenneth Freeman" <ken4bikes@att.net>
Subject: Re: [CR] Were Campy brakes so superior?
To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org


I found Campy brakes back in the day to have an ability to pivot smoothly for a long time. Weinemans had those little red plastic washers and liners that just seemed ot bind up after the first few months. One issue with my Weinemans was they did not stay centered, where Campys did (as do my current pair of 1st gen DuraAce). Because their center point moved after I centered in, I could not tighten the clearance and improve lever response like I could on the Campy.

Was it my technique? maybe, but I still find Campy SRs to have the same attributes relative to Shimano 600 brakes.

Value v. quality? Were they worth $50 /set on top of a $350 bike? Well is the $350 bike twice as good as a PX-10E? To me, quality was represented by the question "Does it work well and deliver the best performance and functionality?" Value is "does it deliver proportionate performance and functionality improvement for the increase in price?" they are not the same thing, and it's wrong to answer a question about the "best" (a quality matter) with an objection about excessive price (a value matter). Another way to look at it is to remember the distinction between "best you can get" and "best for my budget."

As far as why that price was chosen, it's just supply and demand. Campy determined to charge what the market will bear, and base on exclusivity (only tell the racers!! shhh) may have kept demand in line with capacity, for a time at least.

The fact that the Campy lever shapes were more comfortable IMHO than Weineman or Mafac, didn't hurt a bit, just another aspect of performance.

Highly promoted? compared to what, in 1968 or so? Schwinn? THAT was highly promoted, and I don't mean the Paramount! How about compared to Shimano in today's market?

Ken Freeman
Ann Arbor, MI USA


----- Original Message ----
From: Edward Brooks
To: Stronglight49@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2008 7:59:51 AM
Subject: RE: [CR] Were Campy brakes so superior?


Bob, Back in the day I remember that to me one of the distinct advantages of Campy brakes versus the Universal Super 68s or Weinmann 500's was that the Campy caliper arms were beefier and did not flex like the others, and they seemed to stop much quicker and were easier to modulate. This was also probably due to the compound they used for their rubber blocks which also seemed superior, and perhaps that the machining tolerances were closer and more exacting. I also liked the Universals and Weinmanns which were actually lighter than the Campys but my assessment was that the Campys just worked better. Aesthetically of course the Campy brakes were finished very nicely as well... Edward Brooks Chicago, Illinois

-----Original Message----- From: classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org [mailto:classicrendezvous-bounces@bikelist.org] On Behalf Of Stronglight49@aol.com Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 1:57 AM To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Subject: [CR] Were Campy brakes so superior?

In his top 5 component list, Dan Artley mentioned:

"...Campy sidepull brakes as revolutionizing good braking and control. A brake that unlike the Mafacs didn't need dedicated pivot posts on the frame. It may not be the best now, but at the time they came out, nothing else came close. ... Dan Artley in Parkton, MD "

First of all, I do not mean to contest his choice at all, but this does raise an interesting question in my mind.

Why were Campy brakes really that revolutionary?

Yes, like all Campy products were very well made, highly promoted, fairly quickly accepted by the pro teams, but were they revolutionary or significantly superior in design or effectiveness to other side-pull brakes of the late 1960s.

The Universal Super 68 comes to mind. Yes, those still had the sliding arm quick release linkage dating from 1950, and Campy's beautifully simple cam quick release lever was a significant improvement to other systems which come to mind. But, otherwise I can't see anything else unique about the Campy brake design which might distinguish it from perhaps the lowly Weinmann 500 series or probably a few other rather simple side-pull calipers already in use on lower range bikes which might account for improved overall performance. Let me qualify that by adding: "if compared using identical brake pads."

Campy was always extremely successful at promoting their products through their racing team sponsorships. Their products were indeed very beautifully finished. But, why did they command a fee of $50 as an option on a $350 Paramount? Were they really worth what might compare to a $500+ brake "option" if added to a high quality production bike today?

Could someone please explain just how these were significantly superior in design? Honestly folks, I'm not meaning to be argumentative, I'm just ignorant about these things and sincerely would like to know.

Thanks!

Still perfectly content with my Universal mod. 61...

BOB HANSON, ALBUQUERQUE, NEW MEXICO, USA

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