[CR]Fwd: your question about item 1971 Bianchi Pista 360030268436

(Example: Framebuilding:Tubing)

From: <NortonMarg@aol.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 12:11:17 EST
To: freitas1@pacbell.net, classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Subject: [CR]Fwd: your question about item 1971 Bianchi Pista 360030268436

Bob, If you know anyone else who should see this (and look at the bike that started it, please forward. I've put the CR list in the "send to" field, so they have it.

Until I get documentary evidence, I'm leaning toward the 200xxx Bianchis being 1966 to 1969 production. I'm happy to receive evidence either way!

Stevan Thomas aspiring Bianchi historian

In a message dated 3/7/2008 7:00:13 AM Pacific Standard Time, NortonMarg writes:
> Subj: Re: your question about item 1971 Bianchi Pista 360030268436
> Date: 3/7/2008 7:00:13 AM Pacific Standard Time
> From: NortonMarg
> To: ebay@speedbicycles.ch
> CC: edlitton@sbcglobal.net, chuckschmidt@earthlink.net
>
>
>
> In a message dated 3/7/2008 12:02:00 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> member@ebay.com writes:
>
> >> dear stevan. thank you for your qualified comment! the decals are
>> BLACK what will speak for a TEAM FRAME as you wrote. you could
>> be right with the dating of 1973 or later. my indication was the
>> columbus tube decal that was in production until 1972. best
>> regards, stefan schaefter
>>
>
> Hi Stefan,
> It's tricky using a tubing sticker to date something. If the frame was built
> at Reparto Corsa, they could have had a supply of older stickers. The higher
> volume "normali" production would be much more likely to have the latest
> stickers as they're burning through a lot more of everything. It is certainly an
> arguement that it is an "early" version of that style frame but it's much
> safer to date things based on production features.
>
> For sake of discussion, I'm calling the 1960 through 1969 (?) frames the
> first series and the 1970 (?) through 1972 the second series. Clearly the
> integrated headset models predate WW2.
>
> The second series of integrated headset frames (1970 to 1972 as far as I
> know) look identical to the casual observer but there are some subtle visual
> differences and some subtle differences you can't see until you take one apart.
>
> The early frames use a brake bridge that has a flair where it attaches to
> the seat stay. The flair is part of the piece. The late frames have a small
> diamond shaped reinforcment that is brazed as part of the assembly.
>
> The late frames have a thicker headlug to strengthen where the race is
> inserted. Because the outside diameter of the lug is the same, the headset race is
> correspondingly smaller in outside diameter. There was also a change to the
> headset races being made by Campagnolo, with the normal Campagnolo type ball
> races instead of the former "V" races.
>
> They also went back to their 1960s traditional serial numbering. On the ones
> I've seen, on the right side of the seat lug were three numbers 170 through
> 172 (indicating 1970 and 1972 respectively) with the other three numbers on
> the other side of the seat lug. I do not know if 1970 and 1972 are the correct
> "book ends" delineating the style run, these are just the ones I have seen
> with my own eyes. I should add that these are both "team" frames that came in
> celeste.
>
> It's difficult to imagine that Bianchi was selling this later style frame
> when there are pictures of Gimondi winning the Tour of Italy on a second series
> integrated headset bicycle (without chrome on the headlugs) in 1969, with
> that style of bicycle still in production. It's possible, but it would take
> more than a sticker to convince me.
>
> I'm just sharing thoughts here as I have an interest in history and
> Bianchis.
>
> There is another serial number mystery I'm researching. There was a change
> in the numbering sequence of the first series farmes. In 1960 through 1965,
> the serial number prefixes were 160xxx through 165xxx. I have personally
> neither seen nor heard of any serial numbers 166xxx through 169xxx. There are
> identical frames of all models (Specialissima, Competizione and "Team Issue") that
> are numbered 200xxx and 201xxx.
>
> Are these the 1966 and later frames before the second series that start at
> 170xxx? My local restorer Ed Litton painted one of the 201xxx frames and the
> owner remembers buying it BEFORE 1966. If that's true...it's a mystery. I have
> documented from sales records that the 1960s Bianchi bikes were sold at
> retail in the USA about 2 years after production. It would seem at a minimum it
> would take 6 months to a year to get a frame from having the serial number
> stamped in it (before the paint process) to being sold in the US. Certainly for
> a frame sold in Europe, this could be toward the short end of that time
> estimate.
>
> If you can shed any light on this mystery, it would be appreciated.
>
> Looking at the number on the right side of the seat lug, could your track
> bike be 1978? If they were still using the serial number prefix as a date, this
> would be logical. Wouldn't it be great to have a collection of dealer sales
> catalogues from all those years!?!
>
> Stevan
> ps.
> I'm glad it's not my size!
>
>

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