[CR]Was: OLD DeRosa on Ebay. Now: why some more $?

(Example: Books:Ron Kitching)

To: jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net, l4.flyer@gmail.com
Date: Wed, 21 May 2008 11:57:07 -0400
In-Reply-To: <336194.68225.qm@web82204.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
From: "Dale Brown" <oroboyz@aol.com>
cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
Subject: [CR]Was: OLD DeRosa on Ebay. Now: why some more $?

I hardly claim to be an expert on DeRosa, (I have only 1!) but I think this question goes to an important underlying concept that applies to many other bikes...

I think that the closer a product like this is to the hands of the maker, to a low production item or a custom, made to order item... the more it is valued. Value (intrinsic and monetary) is all also tied in nostalgia, prestige of palmares, design features, and other vaporous elements. But think about Masi being the "tailor" and Ugo being King Eddy's personal builder (albeit for a short while)...

In other words, the more the maker "cranks them out" with more and more factory and helpers and hype, the less we tend to be romantic and the quicker we reach for our wallets...

Just my 2 scents...

Dale

Dale Brown Greensboro, North Carolina USA

-----Original Message----- From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net> To: Neil Bonnick <l4.flyer@gmail.com>; Dale Brown <oroboyz@aol.com> Cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org; marcus.e.helman@gm.com Sent: Wed, 21 May 2008 11:36 am Subject: Re: [CR]OLD DeRosa on Ebay #110253252979

This reminds me of a question I've been meaning to ask the DeRosa experts.? I see some DeRosas go for $2000+, yet I also see KOF lugged steel late 80's/early 90's DeRosas go pretty cheap on eBay, a few hundred dollars for a frame or complete bikes under $1,000.

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So what is the the distinguishing difference between the valuable DeRosas and the not-so-valuable DeRosas?? For Pogliaghi, I take it the bikes produced under Rossin, then Basso after Sante's death are much less valuable than the ones produced during Sante's lifetime, while with Cinellis, bikes produced after the company was sold to Columbo are worth much less than those produced before the sale.

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The drop in value seems much less abrupt for Masi, where Alberto-built lugged steel examples seem to command a better price than a Basso-built Pog or a Columbo-built Cinelli.? I assume this has to do with the frames being built by the son of the founder in the same shop used by his father.

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So what about DeRosa?? My understanding is that the company is still controlled by the family and Ugo's sons are still deeply involved in the framebuilding.? So where is the dividing line between "real" DeRosas and less desirable modern ones?

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Regards,

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Jerry Moos

Big Spring, Texas, USA

?

Neil Bonnick <l4.flyer@gmail.com> wrote:

Marcus and Dale, This is an interesting topic on seat stay tops. As far as frame builders casting seat stay plugs into the seat tube / top tube lug - this technique has been practiced as early as the 1930's. I once owned a 1930's Bianchi frame, minus the paint. You could clearly see the brazed joint below the bullet shaped seat stay top and how it was part of the lug. The De Rosa frame in question is definitely from the 1970's. I have a 1973 De Rosa with the same features. Cheers Neil B. Seattle WA.

On 5/20/08, Dale Brown wrote:
>
>
> << I think of Italian style seat stays as being fluted in the 1970's, then?
> moving to cast plugs in the '80's. I know there are exceptions.
> Was DeRosa the first Italian builder to have seat stay plugs made with his
> name on them?? >>
>
> Marcus:
>
> I am pretty certain that in this case, these are flat stamped plates,
> brazed to an angle cut top of seat stay, rather than the solid plugs. I do
> not recall DeRosa ever using concave (fluted) seat stay top treatment...
>
> Hard to say who was the first to use engraved/stamped/embossed seat stay
> top eyes but my foggy memory suggests it was very much earlier....
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> Dale
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> Dale Brown
> Greensboro, North Carolina USA
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: marcus.e.helman@gm.com
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Sent: Tue, 20 May 2008 9:40 am
> Subject: [CR]OLD DeRosa on Ebay #110253252979
>
>
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> I think of Italian style seat stays as being fluted in the 1970's, then
> moving to cast plugs in the '80's. I know there are exceptions.
>
> Was DeRosa the first Italian builder to have seat stay plugs made with his
> name on them?
>
> Best regards,
> Marcus Helman
> Detroit, MI USA
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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