Personally, I don't have a problem with people using Spoke Prep per se...
...I have a problem with those who use it to hide inferior work. I see too much of that.
Also keep in mind that saying oil doesn't belong on spoke threads is like saying that a Phil Wood spoke machine should be operated dry.
Thousands of wheel builders before me for the past 100 years have used oil on their spoke threads...what suddenly in the past year has determined that to be FATAL?
When did butter become deadly - and margerine the no-fault replacement?
Kids for thousands of years were let loose to play, scrape a knee, earn a bruise or two...should I now tell everyone to keep their kids in cages like rats?
Seriously...pressing emergency right-this-instant paradigm shifting fundamentals please...or just admit to being anal about a personal choice.
I use the nipple click and response torque as part of the tensioning process. Spoke Prep tends to muffle it...
And once again, 2000+ wheels using bare threads and oil with no problems.
I'll up my wager. The challenger can bring a couple 300 lb brutes to test our wheels afterwards. The challenger is free to use Spoke Prep.
I don't need it - because I already know that a properly tensioned wheel doesn't require a "glue" to keep the nipples from coming loose.
To each their own...
Bob Shackelford San Jose, CA USA
Quoting Tom Dalton <tom_s_dalton@yahoo.com>:
> Robert St Cyr said:
>
> With the rims I noticed a pattern of the spokes
> closest to the seam to tension more quickly due to the thicker material in
> the rim at the seam. When at Interbike last week I asked one of the velocit
> y reps If this was the case and he said it was true. One can compensate by
> adding a 1 mm longer spoke or simply backing off the spokes in that area ju
> st slightly.
>
>
>
> Robert, I know you know this, but what you've said might be confusing to
> readers. Changing the length of the spoke does not change its final tension
> it only changes where the nipple sits along the length of the thread. You
> might use a longer spoke in the situation that you describe in order to get
> full engagement of the spoke threads, but that does not alter the final
> tension. If the rim builds up in a way that requires relatively tight or
> relatively loose spokes near the joint in order to get it round, as they
> often do, then it's simply a bad rim, though not necessarily unusable or
> defective. It's a common problem, but lenghtening (or shortening) a
> spoke won't resolve it.
>
> This is not unlike calling the setup of indexed shifter cables a tension
> adjustment, when it is really a change to the effective cable length.
>
>
> Robert Shackelford wrote:
> 3. Nipple glues (i.e., dried paint in the old days) are too often a tool
> used
> not to build a better wheel - but instead to obsfuscate a builder's
> inferiority
> complex over proper tensionsing. Tensioning a wheel properly assuming non-
> defective parts make "glues" unneccessary.
>
>
> Robert, while I agree with essentailly all the other stuff you're said
> regarding the unnecessity of dial gauges (useless data for certain, unless
> you're selling specs!) and tensiometers, I strongly disagree with your
> assessment of nipple compounds. While they may be abused by people using
> them to keep weak undertensioned wheels from rattling apart, they also have
> excellent utility in correctly built wheels. My properly built wheels only
> got better and easier to live with when I started to use Spoke Prep. The
> action at the nipple is smoother and you can make smaller changes in spoke
> tension, because the material acts as a lubricant. Unlike oils and greases,
> WHICH HAVE NO PLACE ON SPOKE THREADS, Spoke Prep does not lead to unwindling,
> and actually stabilizes the nipple. In many cases stainless spokes in brass
> nipples can corrode and sieze, and Spoke Prep eliminates this problem too.
> As for materials that form a solid bond, like certain
> Locktite compounds, that's just a bad choice because it interferes with
> later adjustments. So, old school stuff like honey, linseed oil, or old
> paint (new to me) might be be more period correct, but Spoke Prep is a great
> product for skilled builders. Pure lubes (oils and greases) and glues
> (locktite) are more than a little problematic. Lube on the nipple seat is a
> different matter, and not a problem in my experience, though I only do it
> where I can feel a need.
>
> Tom Harriman wrote:
>
> Having both ridden both store bought wheels and wheels of my own making, I
> would like to shed a little light on this subject...
>
> We should all take comfort and pride in the fact that we are helping to keep
> the art of wheel build alive and strong in our culture.
>
>
> Tom,
> Thanks for shedding light on this, but the question was directed specifically
> at Earle, and having built a few hundred wheels myself and handled thousands
> of machine buit wheels, I am familiar with the differences.
>
> When the final result of a job correctly done looks the same, and IS
> the same, irrespective of who did it, it is NOT art. Calling wheelbuilding
> art contributes to the overblown mystique of this basic skill.
>
> I realize that I sound a bit terse here, but I sometimes feel like people
> don't read all the words my messages. I think it was pretty clear where I
> was headed in my message to Earle, which is that I don't think he has any
> objective basis for his unusually high regard for his own product, and I
> certainly don't think of wheelbuilding as some mystical craft, let alone
> art. It reminds me of the day I received a resprayed frame in the mail from
> an unnamed painter, and without telling me he added a large, conspicuous and
> especially ugly decal to advertize his company under my clear coat. When I
> questioned it, he was puzzled as to why I took issue, and said it was "like
> an artist signing his work." When I choose the single color, provide the
> decals and specify their placement, where is the art?
>
> Tom Dalton
> Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, USA
>
>
>
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>
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>
> Tom Dalton
>
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>
> --
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