Re: [CR]Mt Diablo Ride and English wheels

(Example: Framebuilders:Alberto Masi)

Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 06:19:08 -0800
From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [CR]Mt Diablo Ride and English wheels
To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, Ted Trambley <tedtrambley@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <D26709FB-EF68-4855-823C-426666ACB1D0@gmail.com>


As we have discussed here before, many knowledgeable wheelbuilders do not necessarily agree with all of Brandt's theories. Brandt's book is very well organized and is a wonderful step-by-step guide for the beginning or occasional wheelbuilder. With Brandt's boook and a little practice, most people can build quite usable wheels. But there are different ways to do many details of wheelbuilding, and Brandt's way isn't necessarily always the best. I suspect that interlacing spokes as Brandt advocates is probably a good idea, but I really don't know about tying and soldering. I never do it just because it is a lot of extra work and the benefit has long been under debate. But Spence Wolf was a pretty knowledgeable guy, a legend really, so I certainly wouldn't argue that he didn't know what he was talking about. I think the debate about the benefit, or lack thereof, of tying and soldering spokes was probably raging before Jobst Brandt was born.

Regards,

Jerry Moos
Big Spring, Texas, USA


--- On Thu, 1/1/09, Ted Trambley wrote:


> From: Ted Trambley <tedtrambley@gmail.com>
> Subject: [CR]Mt Diablo Ride and English wheels
> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> Date: Thursday, January 1, 2009, 11:30 PM
> Charles Nighbor - I too was on the top of Mt Diablo this
> morning. I
> left Martinez at 8 AM riding my "69 Peugeot PX10 - it
> was cold but
> beautiful. I had a lot of comments about the vintage
> steel.
>
> I have a question regarding the wheels of English bicycles.
> My '69
> Raleigh Sprite, '51 Raleigh Clubman and '51 Humber
> Clubman all came
> with wheels that are built without tucking the spokes in
> when crossing
> them in the pattern which I would think is substantially
> weaker.
> Jobst Brandt calls this interlacing. Why were English
> wheels not
> interlaced? I have two sets of Spence Wolf tied and
> soldered wheels
> for vintage Italian bikes and Jobst says that was
> unnecessary. I am
> going to build up some new wheels for the Humber I'm
> restoring using
> Bayless Wiley track hubs on some NOS Dunlop Special
> Lightweight Steel
> rims. I have always interlaced spokes on my wheels. Is
> there a
> reason I shouldn't on these? Also, did the British tie
> and solder?
>
> Ted Trambley
> Cold on the MTN in
> Martinez,CA USA
> On Jan 1, 2009, at 6:10 PM,
> <classicrendezvous-request@bikelist.org>
> <classicrendezvous-request@bikelist.org
> > wrote:
>
> > Send Classicrendezvous mailing list submissions to
> > classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
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> >
> > CR
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. Re: 1973? Colnago Super - opinions on year?
> (David G. White)
> > 2. Re: WTB Dynoshoe Dynamo bracket (Kai Hilbertz)
> > 3. Confente (Doug Fattic)
> > 4. Re: WTB: Yellow Cloth Bar Tape (2 Rolls) (Drew
> Ellison)
> > 5. Re: Romic Bikes and Removing Bar Covering
> (M-gineering)
> > 6. Grizzly Peak Cyclists Annual Mt. Diablo New Years
> Day ride
> > (Charles Nighbor)
> > 7. Re: Jan and CNC Cycles (Dickey)
> > 8.
> > for sale..rino bb cups..ciami and regina
> freewheels and rando
> > handle
> > bars
> > 9. Re:Rubber Bar cover (Dickey)
> > 10. Re: Romic Bikes and Removing Bar Covering
> > 11. Rubber Bar cover and Romic frame (Jerome &
> Elizabeth Moos)
> > 12. Check out my Facebook profile (Walter Charles
> Skrzypek III)
> >
> >
> >
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 15:01:34 -0500
> > From: "David G. White"
> <whiteknight@burlingtontelecom.net>
> > To: CLASSIC RENDEZVOUS
> <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: Re: [CR]1973? Colnago Super - opinions on
> year?
> > Message-ID:
> <495D211E.9060503@burlingtontelecom.net>
> > In-Reply-To:
> <70e14d4c0901010610v53169d8dg3191777064916196@mail.gmail.com
>
> > >
> > References:
> <495C22EA.2090804@burlingtontelecom.net>
> >
> <70e14d4c0901010610v53169d8dg3191777064916196@mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="ISO-8859-1"; format=flowed
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 1
> >
> > Angel,
> >
> > Thanks for your observations. I've exchanged
> emails today with the
> > fellow from whom I bought the frame and he assures me
> that he never
> > had
> > it repainted and never replaced any decals. Throughout
> the transaction
> > and since he has seemed completely honest and
> trustworthy. And there
> > is
> > nothing on the frame that indicates anything other
> than original paint
> > and decals. So... I wonder if the downtube decal with
> the club within
> > the C is another example of the variability of Colnago
> frames during
> > any
> > given year?
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > David
> >
> > David G. White
> > Burlington, VT
> >
> >
> >
> > Angel Garcia wrote:
> >> I think the latest feature on this bike is the
> club within the C on
> >> the
> >> downtube. I have a 73/74 and it doesn't have
> the clubs there,
> >> otherwise it
> >> appears to be the same.
> >>
> >> Angel Garcia
> >> Long Valley, NJ
> >>
> >> On Wed, Dec 31, 2008 at 8:56 PM, David G. White
> <
> >> whiteknight@burlingtontelecom.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> I've just completed a rebuild on a 70s
> vintage Colnago Super,
> >>> bought a few
> >>> months back from a fellow who says he bought
> it as a bare frame,
> >>> new, in
> >>> 1979 or 1980 from a shop in Palo Alto, CA. He
> says the paint and
> >>> decals are
> >>> original. The details of the frame suggest
> 1973 to me, but many of
> >>> you know
> >>> far more than I do and I'd love to get
> your insights as to the
> >>> year. Here's
> >>> my analysis based on the info I've seen on
> the list in recent years:
> >>>
> >>> According to recent Colnago frame dating info
> that circulated on
> >>> the CR
> >>> list October 2007 the following are the years
> in which certain
> >>> features
> >>> first appeared:
> >>>
> >>> 1972 -- Cable guide braze-ons top of bottom
> bracket shell -- this
> >>> one has
> >>> this
> >>> 1972 -- Water bottle braze-ons on downtube --
> this one has this
> >>> ----
> >>> 1973 -- Wreath seat tube decal with Worlds
> band at top and bottom
> >>> -- this
> >>> one has this
> >>> 1973 -- Fork crown with clubs on top but no
> holes in each side --
> >>> this one
> >>> has this
> >>> 1973 -- Fork tangs with club cutouts (or
> rarely two hole tangs or
> >>> no tangs)
> >>> -- this one has two hole tangs
> >>> 1973 -- Club cutout in lower head lug only --
> this one has this
> >>> ----
> >>> 1974 -- Shifter braze-ons on down tube (option
> before this) --
> >>> this one
> >>> does NOT have this
> >>> ----
> >>> 1975 -- Vertical COLNAGO seat tube decal with
> diagonal Worlds band
> >>> at top
> >>> -- this one does NOT have this
> >>>
> >>> Assuming the above info is correct, then it
> can't be a 1972 since
> >>> it has
> >>> the wreath decal, the club cutout in the lower
> head lug only, and
> >>> the fork
> >>> crown with clubs on top but no holes in each
> side -- features that
> >>> did not
> >>> appear until 1973, yet can't be a 1974
> because it does not have
> >>> shifter
> >>> braze-ons and can't be a 1975 because it
> does not have the
> >>> vertical Colnago
> >>> seat tube decal.
> >>>
> >>> Per a recent email I received from from John
> Murray, he believes
> >>> that 1974
> >>> and later bottom brackets have an oval cut-out
> on the bottom side
> >>> of the
> >>> downtube lug. Mine does not have such a
> cut-out, thus re-enforcing
> >>> the
> >>> notion that this is a 1973 frame.
> >>>
> >>> On the other hand Greg Softly says that on
> reproduction decals
> >>> "...the
> >>> wreath on the seat tube [is] outlined in black
> where the original
> >>> was not
> >>> outlined and not quite so 'busy' in
> design". Mine is outlined in
> >>> black. So
> >>> if Greg is correct, that suggests mine has
> been repainted and has
> >>> replacement decals. Yet, there is no
> indication I can see that the
> >>> paint is
> >>> anything other than original.
> >>>
> >>> That's all I know folks! What year do you
> think this Colnago was
> >>> made? I'd
> >>> appreciate any insights you may have.
> >>>
> >>> See it here:
> >>>
> >>> <
> >>>
> http://www.wooljersey.com/gallery/David-G-Whites-Bikes/1973+Colnago+Super/
> >>>
> >>> Cheers!
> >>>
> >>> David
> >>>
> >>> David G. White
> >>> Burlington, VT
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> >>> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>>
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> >> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >>
> >>
> >>
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 21:18:54 +0100
> > From: Kai Hilbertz <khilbertz@googlemail.com>
> > To: CR List <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>,
> > <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> > Subject: Re: [CR]WTB Dynoshoe Dynamo bracket
> > Message-ID:
> <2FC58BC0-B97B-478C-A86B-C3DF47AF03CF@gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="US-ASCII"; format=flowed; delsp=yes
> > MIME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2)
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 2
> >
> > P.P.S.
> >
> > Just went to the basement and checked, I've got
> one of these "Basta"
> > dynamo holders. Interestingly enough, on the inside
> it's marked
> > "Soubitez MADE IN FRANCE". Go figure.
> >
> > Jerry, if'n you wanna try one out, contact me off
> list and I'll stuff
> > this one in letter and send it at cost.
> >
> > Greets
> >
> > Kai Hilbertz
> > Munich, Germany
> >
> >
> > On 01.01.2009, at 20:49, Kai Hilbertz wrote:
> >
> >> Jan. 01, 09
> >>
> >> Dear Jerry, cc List,
> >>
> >> the pic on the Rose website:
> >>
> http://www.roseversand.de/output/controller.aspx?cid=156&detail=10&detail2=2506
> >> is actually comprised of two photos.
> >>
> >> The top is the entire one piece holder. The front
> has a vertical
> >> slot to attach any dynamo you want at the correct
> height, and right
> >> behind this vertical slot is the round attachment
> hole for the
> >> cantilever boss. Behind the cantilever attachment
> hole, which stands
> >> off from the body at 90 degrees, the holder
> proceeds towards the
> >> rear, where it branches into two tabs that press
> against the fork or
> >> seat stay tube. The tabs are to keep the whole
> assembly with the
> >> dynamo from turning on the axis of the cantilever
> boss.
> >>
> >> Because of the way the dynamo holder is formed, a
> dynamo can be
> >> mounted either on the front fork at the left in
> front of the fork,
> >> facing forwards, or on the right seat stay behind
> the stay, facing
> >> towards the rear. The second pic shows the holder,
> facing in the
> >> same direction towards the front, mounted on a red
> fork. Note that
> >> the fork obscures most of the length of the
> holder, which is behind
> >> it.
> >>
> >> At the top left of the second image, proceeding
> down towards the
> >> middle, you see the rear of a Basta/Union dynamo
> which has been
> >> mounted on the vertical slot of the holder.
> >>
> >> Here are some further pics:
> >>
> >>
> http://www.amazon.de/BASTA-Dynamohalter-f%C3%BCr-Cantilever-Bremsen/dp/B001EIFUYI/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=sports&qid=1230837771&sr=1-6
> >>
> >>
> http://www.veloplus.ch/AlleProdukte/Beleuchtung/MontageteileHalterungen/DYNOFIXDynamohalterfuerCanti-Sockel.aspx
> >>
> >> Note that Basta makes a similar holder to attach a
> rear light. This
> >> lacks a vertical slot to vary the height, but the
> principle is
> >> exactly the same:
> >>
> http://www.roseversand.de/output/controller.aspx?cid=156&detail=10&detail2=2541
> >>
> >> I have no idea if Basta is sold in the US of A. If
> not, and the
> >> Zinkens holder is no longer being made, perhaps
> Peter White might be
> >> interested in importing them?
> >>
> >> Greets
> >>
> >> Kai Hilbertz
> >> Munich, Germany
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> http://www.roseversand.de/output/controller.aspx?cid=156&detail=10&detail2=2541
> >> On 01.01.2009, at 17:20, Jerome & Elizabeth
> Moos wrote:
> >>
> >>> Can't tell from the photo how one secures
> the dynamo to the
> >>> bracket. Are there bits not shown? Must one
> improvise some bits
> >>> to use this with a B&M dynamo? Does
> anyone in America sell the
> >>> Basta?
> >>>
> >>> Regards,
> >>>
> >>> Jerry Moos
> >>> Big Spring, Texas, USA
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --- On Thu, 1/1/09, Kai Hilbertz
> <khilbertz@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> From: Kai Hilbertz
> <khilbertz@googlemail.com>
> >>>> Subject: Re: [CR]WTB Dynoshoe Dynamo
> bracket
> >>>> To: "CR List"
> <Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> >>>> Cc: jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net
> >>>> Date: Thursday, January 1, 2009, 8:33 AM
> >>>> P.S.
> >>>> Basta has a slightly different holder
> which is cheap and
> >>>> also might be
> >>>> of interest. This model is for left-side
> dynamos only:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> http://www.roseversand.de/output/controller.aspx?cid=156&detail=10&detail2=2506
> >>>>
> >>>> Greets
> >>>>
> >>>> Kai Hilbertz
> >>>> Munich, Germany
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On 01.01.2009, at 15:14, Kai Hilbertz
> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> Jan. 1, 09
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Dear List,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Sjscycles.co.uk is out, but Evans has
> them:
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> http://www.evanscycles.com/products/busch-muller/zinkens-dynashoe-lt-bracket-ec006342
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Or just google "Zinkens
> Dynashoe" and see
> >>>> what you get.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Greets
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Kai Hilbertz
> >>>>> Munich, Germany
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 01.01.2009, at 03:25, Mike Schmidt
> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Check with St. John Cyclery in the
> UK. They have
> >>>> more lighting
> >>>>>> brackets than......
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Happy New Year from fridgid New
> York City.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Mike Schmidt
> >>>>>> Artisinal Restaurant
> >>>>>> Park Ave @32nd
> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Dec 31, 2008, at 5:20 PM,
> Jerome &
> >>>> Elizabeth Moos <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> At the risk of starting a
> thread that has
> >>>> nothing to do with Mario
> >>>>>>> Confente, Faliero Masi, or any
> Italian of whom
> >>>> I am aware, I'm
> >>>>>>> looking for a Dynoshoe dynamo
> bracket.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> This is a bracket that
> attaches to a
> >>>> Cantilever brake boss and
> >>>>>>> mounts a dynamo and perhaps a
> front light as
> >>>> well. Peter White
> >>>>>>> used to sell them, but he is
> sold out and says
> >>>> they are no longer
> >>>>>>> made. I don't know if
> B&M made them,
> >>>> but they were often used
> >>>>>>> with B&M dynamos. My
> understanding is
> >>>> that the bracket can be
> >>>>>>> mounted to the cantilever boss
> without
> >>>> interferring with the
> >>>>>>> cantilever caliper. I have a
> Matt Assenmacher
> >>>> touring bike that
> >>>>>>> has cantilever bosses and lots
> of other
> >>>> brazeons, but no dynamo
> >>>>>>> mount, and I hate clamping
> brackets to nice
> >>>> frames. Having sorted
> >>>>>>> out the B&M dynamo
> lighting on the Caygill
> >>>> with some help from
> >>>>>>> Peter White, I really like it
> as well as
> >>>> similar stuff on the new
> >>>>>>> Bates. Doug Fattic is adding
> a brazeon mount
> >>>> to the frame his is
> >>>>>>> finishing for me. Don't
> want to add a
> >>>> brazeon to the Assenmacher,
> >>>>>>> so the Dynashoe sounds lke the
> best option.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Regards,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Jerry Moos
> >>>>>>> Much Colder today than
> yesterday in Big
> >>>> Spring, Texas, USA
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> >>>>>>> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >>>>>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> >>>>>> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>>>>>
> >>>>
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> >>>> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>>>
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >>
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 15:50:16 -0500
> > From: Doug Fattic <fatticbicycles@qtm.net>
> > To: 'Classic Rendevous'
> <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR] Confente
> > Message-ID:
> <C58296B8.111FC%fatticbicycles@qtm.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 3
> >
> > I'm always fascinated by people's opinions of
> what they consider to
> > be the
> > best frames and in particular the value of a Confente.
> I doubt it is
> > possible for most to agree on what makes the
> "best" anyway. The
> > ride, the
> > way it looks - and if it is the ride, what one likes
> another won't.
> >
> > I've always had a bit of a grudge against
> Confente. Not him
> > personally (I
> > can't remember if I talked to him at the 1977 New
> York show) but this
> > attitude got started when I was visiting my relatives
> in Southern
> > California
> > in 1976. I have a cousin (once removed) that started
> Raincross
> > Cyclery in
> > Riverside, CA. I was showing him the bikes I made for
> my wife and I
> > thinking there might be the possibility of some
> business between
> > us. He
> > seemed only politely interested. I was expecting him
> to look close
> > at the
> > lug work and say something nice and find that I had
> apprenticed in
> > England
> > of real interest. Isn't that what family members
> are supposed to
> > do? But
> > no, he wanted to tell me about Confente instead. He
> wondered if I
> > could do
> > brake attachments like him. So he had one of
> SoCal's nationally known
> > racers (a name I've forgotten now) come and show
> me his Confente.
> > That was
> > the first time I saw recessed brake bolts.
> >
> > In retrospect I can see why my cousin had such a high
> opinion of a
> > Confente
> > and held it up to me as the standard. His impression
> was formed by
> > the
> > combination of decals, paint, lug cut-outs, the trick
> brake bolts
> > and the
> > fact that the rider he most looked up to rode one. He
> wasn't looking
> > closely at how my nicely my lugs were filed, etc.
> That in fact didn't
> > matter to him because he wasn't about fine details
> but rather the
> > overall
> > effect. I doubt he paid much attention to mine after
> looking at my
> > plain
> > decals (which I refined a year or so later).
> >
> > Doug Fattic
> > Niles, Michigan
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 12:53:27 -0800
> > From: Drew Ellison <drew@masirider.com>
> > To: Eric Elman <tr4play@cox.net>
> > Cc: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> > Subject: Re: [CR]WTB: Yellow Cloth Bar Tape (2 Rolls)
> > Message-ID:
> <85D2321B-24E4-4F47-9C1D-5FBBD5922F8F@masirider.com>
> > In-Reply-To:
> <000901c96c44$d4d9f6c0$6401a8c0@acerad993ba82b>
> > References:
> <20081226122608.I5TEK.406628.root@mp19>
> > <000901c96c44$d4d9f6c0$6401a8c0@acerad993ba82b>
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="US-ASCII"; format=flowed; delsp=yes
> > MIME-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v930.3)
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 4
> >
> > I bought off of eBay a large spool of yellow cotton
> binding ribbon, or
> > cotton binding tape. It's very similar to
> handlebar tape in looks and
> > size, but thinner, more flexible, and no adhesive.
> When wrapping, it
> > changes direction easier, but you've got to be
> careful about not
> > creating crinkles and folds. But you can buy a 25 yard
> roll for about
> > $10, so you can be very generous in the overlap. It
> comes in different
> > colors and widths, so you can get creative if you
> want. Then some
> > shellac on that and noone can tell the difference. I
> don't see any
> > yellow on eBay at the moment, but keep looking. You
> may also be able
> > to get it from fabric suppliers, dunno.
> >
> > Drew Ellison
> > Everett, Washington USA
> >
> > On Jan 1, 2009, at 11:12 AM, Eric Elman wrote:
> >
> >> Subject line says it all. Anyone?
> >>
> >> Thanks in advance and Happy, Healthy New Year to
> all.
> >>
> >> Eric Elman
> >> Somers, CT USA
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> >> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 22:53:33 +0100
> > From: M-gineering <info@m-gineering.nl>
> > Cc: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: Re: [CR]Romic Bikes and Removing Bar Covering
> > Message-ID: <495D3B5D.3050609@m-gineering.nl>
> > In-Reply-To:
> <444179.86349.qm@web82207.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> > References:
> <444179.86349.qm@web82207.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 5
> >
> > Jerome & Elizabeth Moos wrote:
> > The
> >> stem on the bike is much too short, so even if I
> reuse the bars, the
> >> covering has to come off at least one side to
> change the stem.
> >> Anyone know a way of doing this without destroying
> the bar covering,
> >> or is this an impossible undertaking?
> >
> >
> > syringe with needle: inject water or methylated
> spirits through the
> > covering in several places between bar and grip.
> Redistribute the
> > liquid
> > all over the circumference and push the covering of
> > --
> > mvg
> >
> > Marten Gerritsen
> > Kiel Windeweer
> > Netherlands
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 14:55:49 -0800
> > From: Charles Nighbor <cnighbor1@comcast.net>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR]Grizzly Peak Cyclists Annual Mt. Diablo
> New Years Day
> > ride
> > Message-ID:
> <0FD45F6CA8024F909AC8501233F95AB4@gatewayan2blld>
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 6
> >
> >
> > 1 Jan 09
> > I just rode the Grizzly Peak Cyclists Annual Mt.
> Diablo New Years Day
> > ride. Today 40 riders braved the cold foggy morning
> start at Walnut
> > Creek B.A.R.T. Station. It is about a 4000' foot
> climb at about 5%.
> > You
> > get a 3600 view at the top except today was fog to
> 2500' elevation and
> > than you broke out into sun and clear skies. At the
> beginning and at
> > the Junction half way up I had to look who was riding
> what. And at the
> > Junction there were 40 to 50 more riders besides my
> club.
> > I saw these steel lugged bicycles 1 Bruce Gordon,2 Ed
> Litton, 1
> > Bridgestone, 1 Davidson (mine), 4 rivendells various
> models, 2 Steve
> > Rex's, 1 Paul Taylor with fancy lugs, 1 Della
> Santa, 1 71 Frejus, 1
> > Trek, and I Bianchi. Which is a very good reprehensive
> group for say a
> > total of 65 bikes.
> > Steel is real
> > ''Mount Diablo, one of the most important
> California State Parks, is
> > an
> > isolated 1173 meter (3849 feet) peak from which it is
> possible to view
> > the second greatest surface area seen from any peak in
> the world
> > (exceeded only by Mount Kilimanjaro in Africa). Being
> its highest
> > point,
> > it is one of the rare places in the Bay Area to
> receive some snow. The
> > vegetation of mixed oaks, grasslands, and chaparal is
> typical of the
> > interior hills of the Bay Area. ''
> >
> <http://www.terragalleria.com/california/california.sf-interior-east-bay
>
> > .
> > html>
> > http://www.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=517
> > <
> > Have a great new 2009 year riding
> > Charles Nighbor Walnut Creek, CA USA
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 17:04:00 -0600
> > From: Dickey <ogreer@bellsouth.net>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR]Re: Jan and CNC Cycles
> > Message-ID:
> <D33F39AE2D0742B5860C0040F0162D22@cpugreer>
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 7
> >
> > Jan don't forget about Viko the dog who went to
> work everyday with
> > Fletcher. He kept the worker morale up!
> > Dickey Greer
> > West Monroe,La
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 18:15:14 -0500
> > From: <Rnitro1969@aol.com>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR]
> > for sale..rino bb cups..ciami and regina freewheels
> and rando handle
> > bars
> > Message-ID: <bfe.53fba7b5.368ea882@aol.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 8
> >
> > greetings
> >
> > rino italian chrome finish bb cups
> > with bearings
> > $15.00 shipped
> >
> > ciami gold finish 6 speed freewheel
> > 14-15-16-17-18-20
> > $25.00 shipped u.s.
> >
> > regina oro 6 speed freewheel
> > 12-13-14-16-18-21
> > $25.00 shipped u.s.
> >
> >
> > handle bars.
> >
> > 1 gb randoneur bars
> > 1 gb maes randoneur bars
> > 1 phillippe straight french bars.
> > $35.00 shipped u.s.
> >
> >
> > thanks
> > robbie fellows
> > lakewood,ca.
> > usa
> >
> > **************New year...new news. Be the first to
> know what is
> > making
> > headlines.
> (http://www.aol.com/?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000026)
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 17:21:26 -0600
> > From: Dickey <ogreer@bellsouth.net>
> > To: <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>,
> <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR]Re:Rubber Bar cover
> > Message-ID:
> <57DB08E4D17A48D0B94B96D15E29C349@cpugreer>
> > Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="iso-8859-1"
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 9
> >
> > Hey Jerry, Why not try a long skinny Phillips screw
> driver slid under
> > the sheath after you warm it up a little with a hair
> dryer. Spray some
> > wd40 inside and try rotating the sheath around to let
> the lube run
> > everywhere inside. This works on motorcycle grips,
> but, they are not
> > near as long.
> > Dickey Greer
> > West Monroe,La
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 00:31:39 +0000
> > From: <joeb-z@comcast.net>
> > To: <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>,
> <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Cc: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos
> <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> > Subject: Re: [CR]Romic Bikes and Removing Bar Covering
> > Message-ID:
> <010220090031.15661.495D606A000EDAEC00003D2D221202078496D30D0A0106@comcast.net
>
> > >
> > Content-Type: text/plain
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Precedence: list
> > Message: 10
> >
> > First try: Compressed air. Jam a nozzle under the top
> and see if you
> > can sort of inflate them off the bar. Sometimes this
> works very
> > nicely.
> >
> > Second try: Soap and water. Injected up under the
> covers.
> >
> > Third try: Silicone lubricant.
> >
> > Solvent or oil based stuff may damage the covers and
> tends to soften
> > them a little and thus increase the stick unless you
> flood them.
> >
> > These sound like the Motobecane covers and I can't
> say I ever got
> > those off intact.
> >
> > Joe Bender-Zanoni
> > Whitneyville, CT
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos
> <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> >> After a cold day yesterday, it is warmer today,
> and I am finally
> >> getting around
> >> to cleaning up the 70's or early 80's
> Romic touring bike I bought
> >> in July. I
> >> think the post earliier today about the eBay Romic
> may have
> >> motivated me.
> >>
> >> As mentioned in my below post from July, it has
> rather cool GB bar
> >> plugs, but
> >> also marked "Paris". The concensus at
> the time was that these have
> >> no
> >> connection to Gerry Burgess of GB UK, but are much
> too old to have
> >> been produced
> >> by Gilles Berthoud, who is not that old a man.
> >>
> >> Also mentioned at the time was the bar covering,
> which is made to
> >> look like sewn
> >> on leather bar tape, but is really rubber push on
> stuff, like
> >> GrabOns, only
> >> harder rubber, not foam. At the time several
> people said this
> >> stuff was nothing
> >> special, some thought it downright nasty. Any
> different opinion?
> >> Is this stuff
> >> worth saving? And assuming it were, anyone know
> how to get it off
> >> the bars
> >> without destroying it? In the past, I've
> never tried to save used
> >> GrabOns, not
> >> only becasue I never liked them and because they
> broke up with age,
> >> but because
> >> it looked pretty hard to remove them once they had
> been on a
> >> while. So I just
> >> cut them off and was done with it. The stem on
> the bike is much
> >> too short, so
> >> even if I reuse the bars, the covering has to come
> off at least one
> >> side to
> >> change the stem. Anyone know a way of doing this
> without
> >> destroying the bar
> >> covering, or is this an impossible undertaking?
> >>
> >> Regards,
> >>
> >> Jerry Moos
> >> Big Spring, Texas, USA
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --- On Thu, 7/17/08, Jerome & Elizabeth Moos
> >> <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> >>
> >>> From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos
> <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> >>> Subject: [CR]Berthoud? Bar Covering
> >>> To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>> Date: Thursday, July 17, 2008, 8:55 PM
> >>> Received today this bike:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> http://ebay.com/<blah>
> >>
> temZ110267043540QQihZ001QQcategoryZ98084QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
> >>>
> >>> Those who know me know I am a cheapass, so a
> complete
> >>> touring bike for less than 1/3 the price of a
> Limited
> >>> Edition Ti Brooks Swallow, or $30 more than a
> long sleeve
> >>> Vintage Velo wool jersey is hard for me to
> resist.
> >>> Especially with the excellent SunShine ProAm
> wheels and the
> >>> equally excellent Sugino Mighty Tour cranks.
> And I love
> >>> Weinmann 500 brakes - everything you need -
> nothing you
> >>> don't.
> >>>
> >>> What makes this a bit special for me is that
> Romic was
> >>> built by the late Ray Gasorowski in Houston,
> TX. from who I
> >>> bought my daughter's 24" wheel junior
> road bike and
> >>> a custom track frame In The Day. he also
> repainted a couple
> >>> of bike for me. One surprising thing is that
> the bike has a
> >>> foil decal from a shop in Minneapolis. I
> thought Ray only
> >>> sold through shops in Houston and the
> surrounding area.
> >>>
> >>> Unpacking it I find it has bluish green GB
> rubber barend
> >>> plugs. I thought these were "GB" as
> in Gerry (or
> >>> is it Gary) Burgess, but it also say
> "Paris".
> >>> Does "GB" then mean Giles Berthoud
> instead? If
> >>> so, this raises the issue of the bar
> coverings. As seen in
> >>> the photos, these look similar to perforated
> sewn-on leather
> >>> coverings. But instead, the are rubber. Not
> the fragile
> >>> foam like Grabons, but thick, heavy rubber.
> Could these bar
> >>> coverings be Berthoud as well? If so, I may
> have to rethink
> >>> my initial inclination to cut them off.
> >>>
> >>> Regards,
> >>>
> >>> Jerry Moos
> >>> Big Spring, Texas, USA
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> multipart/alternative
> >>> text/plain (text body -- kept)
> >>> text/html
> >>> ---
> >>>
> _______________________________________________
> >>> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> >>> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>>
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> >> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >>
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 16:36:01 -0800
> > From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos
> <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
> > To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, Dickey
> <ogreer@bellsouth.net>
> > Subject: [CR]Rubber Bar cover and Romic frame
> > Message-ID:
> <505054.48732.qm@web82208.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> > In-Reply-To:
> <57DB08E4D17A48D0B94B96D15E29C349@cpugreer>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Precedence: list
> > Reply-To: jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net
> > Message: 11
> >
> > Well, that worked quite nicely. They came off to
> reveal the Romic
> > was equipped with plain GB randonneur bars, similar to
> those used on
> > Schwinn Super Sports and Sports Tourers. The GB
> marking is on the
> > end of the drops, where it would normally be covered
> with tape. Now
> > whether these bar covers were actually worth saving
> remains to be
> > established.
> >
> > BTW, the frame cleaned up pretty nicely. Amazing how
> much better a
> > good washing and several coats of Mother's Carnuba
> Gold paste wax
> > will make an old frame look. The paint has some
> scratches and
> > chips, but has a nice lustre after waxing. A metallic
> bluish
> > silver. I'm almost sure Ray pained this with
> Imron, even though it
> > is a mid-priced touring frame, probably Tange tubing.
> I know Ray
> > used Imron almost exclsuively for his top frames.
> Some say the
> > alleged toxic nature of Imron may have contributed to
> his early death.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Jerry Moos
> > Big Spring, Texas, USA
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- On Thu, 1/1/09, Dickey
> <ogreer@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >
> >> From: Dickey <ogreer@bellsouth.net>
> >> Subject: Re:Rubber Bar cover
> >> To: jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net,
> classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >> Date: Thursday, January 1, 2009, 5:21 PM
> >> Hey Jerry, Why not try a long skinny Phillips
> screw driver
> >> slid under the sheath after you warm it up a
> little with a
> >> hair dryer. Spray some wd40 inside and try
> rotating the
> >> sheath around to let the lube run everywhere
> inside. This
> >> works on motorcycle grips, but, they are not near
> as long.
> >> Dickey Greer
> >> West Monroe,La
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 18:10:21 -0800
> > From: Walter Charles Skrzypek III
> <invite+yjfszf6c@facebookmail.com>
> > To: Classicrendezvous
> <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
> > Subject: [CR]Check out my Facebook profile
> > Message-ID:
> <31476171c47e1f67302b26b4a3490941@localhost.localdomain>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
> > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > Precedence: list
> > Reply-To: Walter Charles Skrzypek III
> <maguahiker@gmail.com>
> > Message: 12
> >
> > Hi classicrendezvous,
> >
> > I set up a Facebook profile where I can post my
> pictures, videos and
> > events and I want to add you as a friend so you can
> see it. First,
> > you need to join Facebook! Once you join, you can also
> create your
> > own profile.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Walter
> >
> > To sign up for Facebook, follow the link below:
> >
> http://www.facebook.com/p.php?i=1385130528&k=6Y166VP3QY5M5ACAXG66VR&r
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Classicrendezvous mailing list
> > Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> >
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous
> >
> >
> > End of Classicrendezvous Digest, Vol 73, Issue 4
> > ************************************************
>
> _______________________________________________
> Classicrendezvous mailing list
> Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org
> http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous _______________________________________________ Classicrendezvous mailing list Classicrendezvous@bikelist.org http://www.bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/classicrendezvous