Re: [CR] Ideale Alloy Rail saddles

(Example: Framebuilders:Tony Beek)

In-Reply-To: <3233876.1233159162540.JavaMail.root@mswamui-billy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <3233876.1233159162540.JavaMail.root@mswamui-billy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2009 09:57:33 -0800
To: "Marc St. Martin" <marc.stmartin@earthlink.net>, <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>, <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>, <edvintage63@aol.com>
From: "Jan Heine" <heine94@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [CR] Ideale Alloy Rail saddles


At 8:12 AM -0800 1/28/09, Marc St. Martin wrote:
> >I have a question for those who have used
>these extensively. How is the ride? Some have
>said that the ride is very harsh and
>uncomfortable due to what is essentially an
>I-beam undercarriage. If so, I'd think these
>would be very tiring on a long event.

I have only used one alloy saddle, a 1952 Model 57, for any length of time, when I rode a 1952 Rene Herse in a 300 km brevet. After 10 hours of non-stop riding, it did seem less comfortable than the Brooks saddles (steel rails) from the same era that I have used on other bikes. Whether it is the leather or the undercarriage is hard to say.

Several riders on the Herse team switched from Ideale with aluminum frames to steel-framed Brooks in the 1950s in the Poly de Chanteloup. They all claim the Brooks was more comfortable, but the Brooks saddles also had a reputation for better leather.


>Now I get the impression that the Technical
>Trials and some other similar events may have
>been of moderate length,

The Technical Trials gave so many bonus points for light weight that makers chose the lightest, not the most comfortable saddles. Paulette Porthault, who rode for Herse in the 1946 trials, reports her saddle felt as if it was made from wood.
>but bikes like those pictured in Jan's book were
>also extensively used in the long events we
>usually associate with randonneuring,
>culminating in PBP.

Among the riders above are Lucien Detee and Gilbert Bulte, who came first (tied with another tandem) in Paris-Brest-Paris 1956. However, they reported terrible saddle problems. Their tandem is shown in our latest book "The Competition Bicycle."

When you look at other PBP bikes, whether from 1948

http://www.vintagebicyclepress.com/rebour.html

or Macaudière's bike from 1966 in "The Golden Age of Handbuilt Bicycles," you see steel-railed Brooks saddles on the bikes of the fastest riders.
> I know at least a couple of CR members have
>done PBP and probably a lot more have done
>randonneur events of several hundred Km. Are
>these alloy rail saddles very tiring in those
>long events? Does anyone feel compelled to
>switch to steel rail saddles for long distances?

I agree with the old randonneurs, and I would pick a steel (or ti) railed saddle for long rides.

Jan Heine
Editor
Bicycle Quarterly
140 Lakeside Ave #C
Seattle WA 98122
http://www.vintagebicyclepress.com