Re: [CR] Ideale "KM" saddle ???

(Example: History:Norris Lockley)

Date: Tue, 14 Apr 2009 06:49:02 -0700
From: Jerome & Elizabeth Moos <jerrymoos@sbcglobal.net>
To: <zoomdog@pure.net>, CR List <ClassicRendezvous@bikelist.org>, Martin Walsh <mowalsh@verizon.net>
In-Reply-To: <14B57FE5A35741B6990BBD1940ED33DE@Marty>
Subject: Re: [CR] Ideale "KM" saddle ???


You're right, more photos would help, but the stamping in the saddle did say Made in France and T B. I never heard of a KM either, but based on just the one photo, I think this is a genuine Ideale made by Tron et Berthet. The later Ideales made by Leppers or whoever, AFAIK did not have the T B stamp and said French Design or something similar rather than Made in France, as they were actualy made in Holland or Germany.

This probably is not an extremely early Ideale, as the T B stamp only appeared after Marcel Berthet joined the firm. Before that the stamp was F T, not sure is F was Freres or maybe M. Tron's first name. That said, a T & B stamped saddle can still be pretty darned old, as one company history on the web says Marcel Berthet assumed management of the company in 1933, two years after the death of the founder, who was Berthet's Father-in-Law.

I've come to believe that no living human being actually knows how many different models Ideale made, let alone the names and descriptions of all of them. Often the same model number was available in several different versions, like the model 90 with alloy rails or model 80's with distinctly different shapes. The moment one begins to think one has it figured out another model like this KM pops up.

Regards,

Jerry Moos
Big Spring, Texas, USA


--- On Tue, 4/14/09, Martin Walsh wrote:


> From: Martin Walsh <mowalsh@verizon.net>

\r?\n> Subject: Re: [CR] Ideale "KM" saddle ???

\r?\n> To: zoomdog@pure.net, "CR List" <ClassicRendezvous@bikelist.org>

\r?\n> Date: Tuesday, April 14, 2009, 12:08 AM

\r?\n> Hi Jay,

\r?\n> Could you send me a couple more digital photos.......or

\r?\n> post a link with

\r?\n> few more photos of your IDEALE "km" saddle,to the

\r?\n> Classic Rendezvous

\r?\n> List serve

\r?\n> It would help if you show more details of the saddle,in

\r?\n> your photos to

\r?\n> get some feedback from CR list members.Photos of the

\r?\n> rivets,cantle plate

\r?\n> underneath,rails weather steel or alloy would help.

\r?\n> Where is the saddle made?

\r?\n> It's not clear in the one photo link that you posted.

\r?\n> The "D" in IDEALE looks different to my

\r?\n> eye........I'll have to look at

\r?\n> an Ideale saddle on Tuesday in the light.

\r?\n> I've never heard of a model called "KM".

\r?\n> Chuck Schmidt sells and IDEALE catalog on his website:

\r?\n> http://www.velo-retro.com/

\r?\n> I'm hoping some of the other "Ideale" experts

\r?\n> chime in ........Jerry

\r?\n> Moos,Peter W,Tim......

\r?\n> Any other details that you could provide us with might

\r?\n> help.

\r?\n> Did it come on a bicycle from a certain vintage etc.

\r?\n> Marty Walsh

\r?\n> Vienna, Virginia, USA