As Lou Deeter has correctly pointed out, I made a slight error in that the Magni-Ferrari frame seen in Dale's shop has a braze-on front tab, generally accepted to have come into use in Italy, around 1982. Thanks Lou.
Ciao, Mark Agree Southfield MI USA ~ ~ ~
In a message dated 8/10/2009 7:26:41 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, LouDeeter writes:
The red and yellow one that was in Dale's shop? I thought it had a braze-on front derailleur...
-----Original Message----- From: FujiFish1@aol.com To: classicrendezvous@bikelist.org Sent: Mon, Aug 10, 2009 6:11 pm Subject: Re: [CR] eBay Outing ICS Magni
Hey George, I've saved pics of a bunch of different Magni / Losa bikes and frames that have gone by on the Internet, one way or another. The existence of front derailleur tab, but no seat tube bottle bosses, speaks of approx. 1982-84 in general, but I guess it is conceivable that it's as late as 1987, as the "875" stampings under the b.b. might suggest. I have a bunch of pics of a Magni-Ferrari frameset that was hanging in Dale's shop ... very similar, but no front der. tab, and there are Portacatena holes in the dropouts. That frame is stamped 826, which could logically stand for 1982. Pics of all the later framesets I can find, be they labeled Magni, Losa, etc. have water bottle bosses on the seat tube. Just some points for potential dating...
A gorgeous chrome frame that one on Ebay is ... thanks for outing it!
Ciao, Mark Agree Southfield MI USA ~ ~ ~
Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2009 15:58:04 -0400 From: George Hollenberg <_ghollmd@gmail.com_ (mailto:ghollmd@gmail.com) > Subject: [CR] eBay Outing ICS Magni To: Classic Rendezvous _classicrendezvous@bikelist.org_ (_mailto:classicrendezvous@bikelist.org_ (mailto:classicrendezvous@bikelist.org?) )
eBay # 200371856693 This is a nicely chromed ICS frameset made by Losa for ICS. These framesets were then finished in Zurich by ICS ( ItalCicliSystems), formerly owned by Mr. Artemio Granzotto. Dating of these famesets isn't always easy and this may be beyond the CR limit of 1983. I can reach Mr. Granzotto if there is any interest in this information. ICS chroming was among the best in the bike business. ICS dedicated itself pretty much to the "glitz" end of the trade. Of course, in the case of ICS, the collar is worth more than the dog-the corresponding ICS modified Campagnolo groups tend to be very pricey in chrome and crazy expensive in gold. That having been said, the framesets were built up to the clients' wishes--sometimes in mixtures of ICS and non ICS parts. Furthermore, sometimes, bikes were kitted with mixtures of SRecord and CRecord parts as well. This frameset looks to be in pretty nice shape-the decals can be had from Greg Softely in Australia. Although I'm friends with the seller, Mr. Granzotto and Greg Softely, I have no business connections with them other than as a client.
-- George
George Hollenberg MD
CT, USA