Re: [CR] "Path Racer" "Road-Path" nomenclature (Ed Granger) (Long)

(Example: Bike Shops:R.E.W. Reynolds)

References: <4AE6A8F8.CB1D.00FE.1@baltimorecountymd.gov>
To: <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org>
Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2009 08:26:46 -0400
In-Reply-To: <4AE6A8F8.CB1D.00FE.1@baltimorecountymd.gov>
From: <loudeeter@aol.com>
Subject: Re: [CR] "Path Racer" "Road-Path" nomenclature (Ed Granger) (Long)


What is the correct term to describe a bike frame with track dropouts but with drilled brake bridge and fork for front and rear brakes that also has road, not track, geometry? Is it path-road as Mick suggests? While I acknowledge that we Americans may have butchered the nomenclature by calling them Path Racers, it does seem to be a good descriptive term to me. This reminds me of the early 80s when off-road bikes first came out and the community argued about whether they were All Terrain bikes, Mountain bikes, or Off-road bikes. When I hear the term "Path Racer" I know exactly what someone is talking about. I have one myself, made by Jim Redcay. Sometimes our common language adapts, whether we like it or not. Lou Deeter, Orlando FL USA

-----Original Message----- From: Daniel Artley <dartley@baltimorecountymd.gov> To: Classic Rendezvous <classicrendezvous@bikelist.org> Sent: Tue, Oct 27, 2009 8:02 am Subject: Re: [CR] "Path Racer" "Road-Path" nomenclature (Ed Granger) (Long)

When I first built my off topic Surly Steamroller (brakes and fat tires) for the 'path' rail trail next to my house, I'd used the term path racer since I'd heard rumours (English bikes after all) that path machines were the combination racing and hack bike, and was quoted back in the early days of the Fixed Gear Gallery, later to my chagrin when I heard otherwise. This is what I posted to the FG list back in 2005 from information acquired around 2002:

I've been curious about the description of a path racer, and asked Mick Butler of the UK what his description was. Chuck Schmidt added some stuff for me from his off list questions, and I've collected the miscellaneous responses into one posting for those interested in a bit of fixed gear history. (Some responses are somewhat dated.) Enjoy!

Dan Artley in Parkton, Maryland

British Road/ Path or Road track Bikes

The craze for this type of hybrid machine started in the mid 50's and lasted to about the early 70's. These dates are a general approximation. Road/Path models were used for everything from general club riding, time trialing, grass track and pure track. On the track they were used in sprints, pursuits, point to points and devils. Our outdoor tracks of this period tended to have quite shallow bankings.

Basically they were 73 degrees parallel with a bottom bracket height of less than eleven inches and a wheelbase of around 41" invariably with mudguard clearance and brake drillings. The type of track ends used on these frames were the special 2" long slot type. This allowed wide variations in gear ratios especially when using inch pitch. Our pure track bikes of this period were of a much shorter wheelbase, less than 41" and with a bottom bracket height of over eleven inches. No mudguard clearance or drillings and free from any braze-ons. Typical head angle of 75 degrees and seat of 73. Just to confuse you even more on these type of models there was a fashion in the 60's to have a road/track built with Mafac cantilever bosses brazed on the front forks. Primarily used for time trialing the weight of these machines with all alloy parts was around the 16 pound mark on fixed wheel. These were also used on the track if you could get past the scrutinizers, sometimes they refused or just asked you to tape up the cantilever bosses if you were lucky. These frames were often fitted up with a trike conversion and used as winter hacks. If you care to dig out your old 60's Cycling's there is a road test on a Mercian built to this type of specification. I have a 1960's 24" Allin Stan Butler just like this for sale.

Mick Butler Huntingdon UK

Track bikes were known as track bikes in England from post-WWI onwards. Pathracer was a rather old-fashioned term used in some catalogues and just occasionally in the press in the 20s. It was not used then to describe multipurpose machines though back in the teens path racers were often used for time trials. Road/track iron or road/track bike was a term used mostly post-WWII (though I think it originated in the 30s) to describe a bike with rearward facing track ends which was designed for use on the road as well as the track. Road racing had not existed in Britain since the 1890s and it was only in1933 that the first road race was again rerun. Road racing bikes from about1933 onwards in England were normally fitted with gears, some early ones used hub gears but the vast majority were fitted with derailleurs and used on circuits such as Brooklands, IOM or Donnington prior to 1943. Time trial bikes were different, most bikes used for the shorter distances (10s, 25,50s) were fixed wheel in the 30s. >From the middle/late 30s gears were increasingly used for longer events (100, 12hr, 24hr). Gears were not used to win the National 25 until about 1960. Derailleurs and hub gears were used initially with hub gears even then in the minority. Derailleurs gradually assumed the completely dominant position.

Hilary Stone Bristol, England

Path is the old fashioned Victorian/ Edwardian cycling term for track. So a path bike is purely for the track. High bottom bracket, no clearances and no drillings for brakes. A Road-Path is a bike with track ends that is dual purpose for both road and track racing, angles not quite as steep and bottom bracket lower than a pure path (track bike). Normally has the front fork crown drilled for a brake. Can also be built with mudguard clearances and mudguard eyes. 27" or sprints can be fitted. Another term for Road-Path is Road-Track. Makers like Selbach and others used to call this type of bike a D.P. prewar, which stood for dual purpose. Rotrax the maker coined their name by using the word play road/track.

Mick.

Just to elaborate on what Martin has said already, 'path' was a popular term pre WWII for racing on fixed distance (four laps to the mile?), i.e.: hard tracks, typically constructed of cement, cinder or asphalt. There were both amateur and professional World *Path Championships, first won by Zimmerman in 1893, and the Belgian rider Protin in 1895 respectively. His countryman, Jef Scherens, appears to have been the most prolific winner, taking the professional championship 6 times in a row from 1932 and finally a 7th time in 1947. Grass track was (and remains) popular in the UK, but apparently much to do with the distinct lack of decent hard tracks. The machines used for Path racing were essentially a modern track bike, and in England under the (National Cyclists' Union (N.C.U.) could not race with wing nuts, brakes, freewheels or any accessory whatsoever, and required bar end plugs. 74/75 deg. head tubes were popular as were so-called Path or Track outward facing ends, 11 inch bracket heights, short fork rakes of 1.5-1.75 inches and round section tapered fork blades.

Though the magazine Cycling used and mixed both the generic term 'Path' and 'Track' pre-war and until the early 1950's to describe racing on hard tracks, by the end of that decade 'Track' became almost a universal description, and by 1960, 'Path' had all but disappeared. Manufacturers did likewise. When the word 'Path' was added to a model name i.e. Hobbs Championship Path, it was built as a track bike, with no drilled fork crown or brake bridge. Road / Path machines appear to have sold as purely a track bike but with the fork crown drilled to accept a brake caliper and little else. Whether anyone turned up in 1950, and stripped off their lights, brake caliper, brake lever, and mudguards etc. is debatable. Just how many would have fitted a freewheel to the machine that having arrived at the track meeting would either be removed or the wheels swapped even more so.....(though Cyclo did produce nice wee brackets for carrying them)....I guess in reality club-level folk turned up with only the front brake to remove (Hilary ?) The typical 30's road racing machine can be mistakenly called a 'path racer'- these were generally single speed fixed machines but with much more relaxed angles and short seat tubes against a long top tube (18"/23"), with a front and/or rear brake and more often than not in Scotland at the start of the season anyway - mudguards front and rear as well, and - as required by the reg's - a bell ! If you were a smart road man you would have a freewheel on the other side to get you home after the race when your legs were done-in apparently! I've had a 1937 Sun Wasp set up as such, and still have a 1930's Bates that came likewise.

Bob Reid Stonehaven, Scotland _______________________________________________ Fixed-Gear mailing list Fixed-Gear@lists.davintech.ca http://lists.davintech.ca/mailman/listinfo/fixed-gear

Archive-URL: http://search.bikelist.org/getmsg.asp?Filename=classicrendezvous.10910.1493.eml

Date: Sun, 25 Oct 2009 20:11:22 -0400 From: <edvintage63(AT)aol.com> Subject: [CR] "Path Racer" "Road-Path" nomenclature (Ed Granger) ( http://search.bikelist.org/query.asp?SearchString=%22%22Path+Racer%22+%22Road%2DPath%22+nomenclature+%28Ed+Granger%29%22&SearchPrefix=%40msgsubject&SortBy=MsgDate%5Ba%5D )

I would appreciate it if Norris (or someone else knowledgeable on the subject) would weigh in on this, as two different terms seem to be extant in the thread regarding KOF road-path frames. It's my understanding that "path racer," the term that inaugurated the discussion, properly refers to a "pure" track design - no braze-ons, higher bottom bracket, steeper angles. A "road-path," on the other hand, refers to a "hybrid" design that uses track ends (allowing the bike to be entered into races on shallower tracks), but with a lower bottom bracket, braze-ons, and more relaxed angles, to allow for use in time trials, club rides, and training. Some clarification here from the British cycling experts would be appreciated (by me, anyway).

Ed Granger
Lancaster, Pennsylvania, USA