Re: [CR] value of a restoration was re: restoration issues

(Example: Production Builders:Cinelli)

From: <"">
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 18:04:36 +0000
To: <>
Subject: Re: [CR] value of a restoration was re: restoration issues


Not sure why gloss of the clear is an issue. If all the paint is on thin and correct, the gloss is easily adjusted to your taste. One of the best ways to kill the gloss and get it to look more original is to RIDE the damn thing. Let it age. But the process can be accelerated quite easily. One will not be able to stain Imron with tea bags, however.

Brian Baylis
La Mesa, CA

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Charles Andrews
Subject: [CR] value of a restoration was re: restoration issues
Date: Thu, 12 Nov 2009 09:03:57 -0800

Mike Shiffer wrote, in part:

I'm curious about your thoughts on the value of restoration. To be very clear about this


This is always an interesting question. It's complicated. The general, it's rare to be able to retrieve the cost of a restoration of a bicycle when you sell the bike. But that's not always true. It's easier to get your cost back out if the bike is rare and valuable to begin with, and the restoration has been done with at least some consideration of period-correct issues.

Cinellis are especially interesting here since they're fairly easy to restore to plausibly original condition. Decals are easy to find in high quality. The paint is one color, fairly simple masking around the lugs. Re-chroming lugs will be quite expensive to do correctly, but even that cost might be recouped if the whole job is done right. And by right, I mean in such a way that it'll appeal to the sorts of people who have the money and the desire to buy this kind of thing. Take a trashed Cinelli frame you've purchased for, say, 500 bucks. The paint is toast, decals gone, chrome is bad. A complete repaint, with correct decals and chrome, is going to run 1200 to 1500 bucks, depending on who does it

Joe Bell has done many of these, as has CyclArt, those are the two I have dealt with most often. Brian Baylis does a nice job with Cinellis but you'd have to contact him for his availability to do a job like that. There are a number of restorers on this list who would probably be glad to give you a quote.

With Cinellis it's important to use a very fine-grained silver--Baylis has used a beautiful silver used on Alfa Romeos, but I don't know what the availability of that might be. Many cinellis from back in the day have almost a satin finish in the paint, and they did when new...not terribly glossy, and often the decals were applied with no clear over them, although this is variable. I've seen clear-coat on them too, but very, very thin, and often with a satin finish just like the paint. And some of that might be aging. The original clear-coats occasionally yellowed too, but I wouldn't want to reproduce THAT.

You really want some kind of clear on a metallic paint, but to get the most convincing period-correct look, the clear-coat cannot be too glossy, and it has to be thin so that the decals stand proud of the paint.

If you want a modern look you can bury the decals in clear, and the whole will be very glossy, but it's not period-correct at all. Still, some folks like that look and will pay for it. If you're concerned about getting your cost back out at some point, it's worth considering these problems carefully at any rate. You could, for instance, try to split the difference, with a glossy, but thin clearcoat, for instance.

Anyway, back to your finished frame, whatever flavor you choose for your respray. You have about 2 grand in it. NOS or near NOS parts for it are probably going to run you another grand, all up, that's assuming you have new wheels built, for instance. You might be able to find all near-NOS stuff for less than that, but it'll take time and patience.

Clean, original Cinelli Super corsas from the early and mid 1970s routinely sell on ebay for about 3000 bucks. So, by this scenario, you're right in the ball-park, always assuming you can find someone who will pay 3 grand for a repaint. If the repaint is attractive enough (in whatever way), you probably can get close to 3K for it. Much depends on how you market it, which is true for any fine thing. Been there. Done that. Got the tee-shirt.

Many prefer to pay that much only for original paint and parts. If that's the crowd you want to appeal to, you have to do a careful, period-correct job. If you do a modern job, and bury the graphics in clear, then you might be rolling the dice in terms of retrieving your cost, but, as I say, there are plenty of folks who like that look, and might well pay you full retail for it on resale. But that's a bit more chancy.

One other idea I forgot to mention is to chrome the entire frame! Cinellis came like this, and you avoid many issues of both correctness and appeal with a full chrome job. You don't even need a clear coat as the decals were applied right on the chrome with no clear. A full chrome job might even cost less than paint. However, the wrinkle is finding a chromer who will do the job right. Something to consider, anyway.

My plugged nickle.

Charles Andrews Los Angeles

"everyone has elites; the important thing is to change them from time to time."

--Joseph Schumpeter, via Simon Johnson _______________________________________________

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